What's up, DTC Pod? Today we're joined by Jenny Meyer and Melissa Connor of JBC PR. So guys, I'll let you kick us off. Why don't you tell us a little bit about JBC and your both respective backgrounds in PR and getting everything up and running at JBC.

Melissa, do you want me to take this one?

You can kick off and then I'll jump in with my spiel.

So Melissa and I actually have similar backgrounds. We both worked at various various agencies and in house in PR for a while. We actually met because I hired her at a now defunct PR agency about, I don't know, Melissa, maybe like 15 years ago now. Maybe twelve years ago now.

Not put timing on anything, please.

Yeah, the joke there is that I hired her. I was running comms at this PR agency. I met her, she was super young, super, super smart, and I was like, yeah, come work with us. She accepted the job, she started the job, and one day later I resigned. And so, funny enough, we never even really had the opportunity to work together. But she made such a mark on me that I kind of made a mental note in the back of my head that if we were I were to ever do anything with a leadership role, I would find a way to somehow kidnap her and get her to work with me, because I was really insanely wowed. By her at a really young age. So after kind of doing PR for various brands, specifically, actually fashion, we did a lot of fashion. We both kind of hit a crossroads at the same time. So about ten years ago, we both found ourselves, frankly, extremely bored. We had been doing PR for a really long time. Brands were just kind of expecting the same results from kind of traditional agencies. Traditional agencies were operating with the same roadmap they had been operating with for frankly, decades. And there didn't seem to be a lot of agencies. There were a few. But addressing kind of this shift with the consumer and this shift in the economy and this shift in the media landscape and how people were beginning to consume information. So it was no longer about reading a magazine and seeing like a really cute pair of jeans and going into a store and saying, look, I saw this pair of jeans in Lucky magazine and I want to buy it. It really became about I listened to a podcast today and I heard them mention this really cool direct to consumer dish company and now I want to Google it. And now I read an article on SAS company and then, funny enough, the next day I saw it on the Today show. So everyone started kind of getting bombarded by information and we didn't feel like there were really enough agencies out there that were addressing this new boom in innovative businesses. But also the shift in how the media was behaving. So we started JBC, frankly, as like a really small consultancy. Like, it was Melissa and I sitting on our couches. We rarely saw each other. I sat on my couch on the Upper West Side. She was in Brooklyn. And we just were kind of like, listen, we'll find some brands and we'll see if we can approach their media relations in a really strategic way. So not just about kind of like, straightforward product placement, but around real, meaningful storytelling. How do we tell really interesting narratives about the founders how do we tell really interesting narratives about the product, about how this brand began? So kind of like a little bit of a more intellectual type of PR, but a PR that took more time and a lot more effort, a lot more creativity. And frankly, we did that for a year, and it was awesome because we got to sit on our couches and consult and make a significant amount of money, and we were both really happy. But what happened was brands started kind of calling us and saying, listen, we keep reading these really great stories about brand X, Y and Z, and they say, you're doing the PR. Can we talk to you? And then it just kind of happened. And I always say, like, we didn't have a business plan. Neither Melissa nor I wanted to run an agency. I was so anti agency by that point. I was like, if I talk to someone else at an agency, I'm going to lose my mind. The whole way agencies were set up, frankly, were set up to fail, there was like this whole kind of image of a lot of peer agencies just being really kind of catty, mean girls. We were not into it. But as we started getting this interest from brands, we started realizing we can do this differently. We can actually take everything we've learned from working at other agencies and retaining other agencies and do the opposite, take every mistake, take everything that made us insane and try to fix it. And that's essentially how this agency was born. And to this day, fast forward nine years later, we have 50 something clients and 50 something people and, you know, a few different offices. And I really, truly do think our take on how we approach media relations, how we approach running our business, has been a really positive impactful kind of thing for both of us. And I can honestly say it hasn't for one day felt like a tedious job or a traditional kind of PR situation. But Melissa, I'll let you talk a little bit more about why we started.

Yeah, I mean, I think when we were doing what we were doing, just the two of us, we got to the point where we realized we were on to this secret sauce. And it was two really simple things. One was the brands that were most exciting to us were the disruptors. They were the ones who were doing new things in their categories. They were leaders, they were innovators. But their choices with agencies was either go to a consumer agency and not get any support on the business and thought leadership side, or go to a tech and business focused agency and not get any support on the consumer side versus going somewhere that could really service the full brand holistically. Because I really don't see how you can split those two things up. So that was one thing. We were addressing the brand's needs on every layer and every level that existed within that brand. So we were talking to their consumers on a regular basis, but we were also creating thought leaders around the brand itself and also the founders or executives behind the brand. So it was a full scope. The other side of that is Jen already mentioned this, the agency brand relationship sucks and the reputation for it is awful. And the beauty of kind of what we've experienced in our careers is we've been on both sides. Jen and I have both have been in house and we both have worked on the agency side. So we've seen it and we've understood it and we get it. And there were just so many things broken about the relationship. So for us it was like, first we're going to just do PR better and more holistically for brands, but also let's change the relationship with our clients. And I think small things we've done have really made a huge impact with just the partnerships we have. They're so much more dynamic, they're so much deeper, they're longer lasting because of that trust that's built really early on and that transparency. So I think it's just those two key things really have created what is JVC? From even day one when there were four clients all the way till now one of our clients who is one of our early who's? Still a colleague now and a friend, but a very early client was like, if you can maintain these two things that you're doing, which is stick with this category. Brand is truly innovative, but also stick to this level of service and protect this relationship with your partners, you guys will be golden. And I've never forgotten and I don't think Jen has either. And that's what we're constantly reevaluating and thinking and are we optimizing not just what we do as a service, but our relationship too, with our brands?

No. And one of the reasons I was so excited to talk with you guys is you guys obviously work with a lot of the top brands in the direct to consumer commerce landscape. And what I'd really love to kind of start to unpack is if you guys, maybe Jenny or Melissa, whomever wants to take it, if you could just paint us a little picture of what the PR landscape looks like right by you guys. Working in this landscape for so long. What are some of those partnerships and relationships you've been able to develop? And then for the brand, what do they need to be thinking about when it comes to PR to be able to make sure they're positioned well for growth and everything that they want to do?

I mean, I can speak to the brand side first and maybe you can speak to the other. I think when a brand is launching, first of all, I can't stress the importance of PR. I think there's a lot of brands that we've talked to and they'll come to us and they're like, listen, we decided to just launch with influencer, or we're just launching with digital marketing. And they come back three months later and they're like, Shit, we needed PR because at the end of the day, people may forget an influencer post about a breakfast cereal or a new headphone. But at the end of if you read a really kind of meaty piece in Fast Company or the New York Times or Tech Crunch or Forbes, that's going to be long lasting. You're going to remember that that brand is going to stay in your head because you took the time to understand who's the founder, what's their background, what's the brand, how did it come about? And so I think PR to me is an absolute priority when you're launching a brand. But here's what people don't realize, is there's many different ways to get PR and many different avenues you can take. So I think a lot of brands figure the only way to do PR is to hire a super expensive external agency. And that's just not true anymore. There are so many great consultants, there are so many great super scrappy, tiny agencies, and then of course, there's monster huge agencies like an Edelman or Weber Shamwick, agencies like that that have been around for decades. So it's really about figuring out what's the best fit for your brand. And that takes time. I always say it's like dating. Like you really have to spend time with the people at this agency. Who's going to manage your account? Do I see myself comfortable talking to this person every single day? Do I trust the people on this team? So there are options for anyone. You can find a consultant for as cheap as a few hundred dollars a placement or a month or a project, and then you can spend $50,000 a month on a large kind of multifaceted agency. The good news is there's really something for everyone. You don't just need to spend all that money to kind of have some sort of meaningful PR moment surrounding your launch. And I don't think people realize that. I think people just assume, I can't afford PR for my launch, so I'm just going to double down on XYZ. There is a way to do it, and also you could do it internally. That's the truth, if you are smart and you're scrappy and frankly, you have no budget whatsoever for PR and you have a really fantastic story to tell, then it's as simple as emailing an editor or calling an editor, figuring out who's going to respond best to that story and sharing your story. That's what PR is. So to me, PR is absolutely essential, and there's just many different ways to do it and find the right partner. And I think that finding the right partner piece is really tricky. And you should kind of devote some time to finding the right partner because what you don't want to do is feel super rushed. Find a PR agency partner three weeks later, you know, one week before your launch, say, Shit, these people totally don't get what I'm talking about. They have no results. This is not the right partner for me. So from a brand perspective, again, I don't think there's anything more important when it comes to launch other than having a functional website, but then having the right story to tell and the right people to tell it.

Yeah, I think one thing that you mentioned really jumps out is the importance of PR. And it seems like a lot of founders that think about PR, it's almost like something that they're not thinking about until they're like, oh, we have a launch coming up, and now we want to get placed in all these different media outlets, so now let's go find our PR. Whereas what you're kind of saying, and I definitely agree with it, is like, you need to be thinking about PR as like a real partnership. If it's something that you're able to do in house and you can put that effort in house, you can do that. But clearly, like, you guys having worked in the space for so long, you're going to be able to expedite that process. You guys are probably going to be a great partner for a lot of different brands, and maybe there's brands of different sizes or scopes or niches that aren't the exact right fit. So what you're kind of saying is, hey, PR is a really important piece of the puzzle. Make sure you give PR thought, just like you give everything else thought, and evaluate those partnerships so that when it comes time to launch, you have someone. Because I've seen it so many times.

So many times. Yeah, you want to have someone locked into go ahead. I know you're going to say what.

I was going to say probably. But what I was going to add to what Jenny said was, you can't think of PR. I can't offer emphasize how important PR is as a function of your business, no matter what stage you are, especially if you're launching. And you can't think of it as an afterthought because what we say time and time again every time we talk to people about PR and we talked about this before we started, is we firmly believe that it is the most scalable investment you can make in your brand 100%. Because the stories that are told exist in real time, all the time. Whether it's broadcast online, you can always refine that print placement. But the way it can be repurposed and also the effect it has on every other external function of your brand is immeasurable. It is truly something you can repurpose for paid media. It impacts how hard or easy it is to work with influencers. It makes it much easier when you want to work with other brands for strategic partnerships. It helps with investors. We can't tell you how many times we hear from our clients that a particular story or body of work over time how much has impacted their business in ways beyond just traffic and revenue. One client said, an investor who I've been chasing for two years finally answered me after they saw that story in the Wall Street Journal that you got me and now they're going to invest. And it took the one story. In another way it works is once you have that machine up and running and that great body of stories happening regularly, you can take all the money you're investing in all these other channels and start decreasing. That because your investment in PR was so smart and is working so well that you can spend less in all those other areas because the press is really driving the efficacy of all those other channels. So I'd say this time and time again, and a lot of founders don't believe us when we say these things, but then once they feel it and they see it, then it's like they're preaching the same thing. So I can't emphasize it enough.

And one thing that I've seen time and time again is it's like I think a lot of founders might get bucketed into thinking of PR as purely a PR channel or purely a performance channel when it goes hand in hand with the other stuff you're doing. So if, for example, if you're just running Facebook ads right when you turn those off, that's it. But if you're running that strategy in conjunction with really good PR, when you serve an ad to a new customer, yes, there is performance where people convert on the spot, see your ad, purchase it, et cetera. But a lot of times there's a lot of discovery and product discovery and they're looking for that second signal of trust to go with it. So if you're baking in your PR strategy where you're able to say, okay, we're going to have our performance marketing on one arm, but we're going to have laid a solid foundation of PR. So when someone sees our ad and goes to check us, like look us up on Google or look us up, they see us come up in all these things, they read these stories and they're like, okay, this makes sense, it checks out. And they have the trust, especially when shopping from a new brand for the first time, right?

Exactly.

Yeah. And something else you mentioned, melissa actually didn't say what I wanted to say, so that's exciting. And you brought this up, Wayne. I think a lot of the time people think about PR as an afterthought, which is what you said. And the tricky thing there is, at the end of the day, when you hire a publicist or a PR agency, you don't want them just kind of like regurgitating what you told them. You want to spend time with these people so they truly understand the DNA of your brand. And you can't do that in two days. So ideally, when you're looking for a good PR partner and you know you're launching and say like, may, you want to start spending time with those people in March so that you can work together to develop the messaging, as you said, work with all these other streams of communication. So make sure that PR is talking to the social media team, talking to the retail team. You need to make sure that whatever the overarching messaging is, it's communicated across all different platforms. And that doesn't happen in two days. That takes time. I think Melissa worked at a pretty big agency a while ago, and she used to tell me how she would walk into the office and they'd be like, okay, we have a new client. Start pitching them tomorrow. And she'd be like, I've never even seen the products. I've never tried it. I've never met the founder. So we really kind of stress that when you're talking to a PR partner, whether it's a person or an agency, get to know them and make sure they understand who you are and what your brand is all about, because they're going to be the people that are out there talking about your brand. They're going to be the people that are selling your brand to the editorial community in many different ways. So it shouldn't be and ideally shouldn't be a rushed process because it's an important one.

No, absolutely. And one thing I'd love to also kind of get into now is why don't you tell us a little bit about some of the brands that you guys have had the pleasure of working with over the years at JBC. And maybe we can kind of from there, go into how some of these brands that you've worked with, how you guys thought about working together and helping them, whether it was through launch or different stages of growth.

Well, one of our favorites and one of our longest standing clients, which I think is great because it shows the evolution of a relationship between a brand and agency, is parachute. I think everyone knows parachute. Everyone loves parachute for a lot of reasons. And when we first started working with Ariel, who's the CEO and founder, she was in her first category with her first product, which is Bedding Sheets. So this is like year one, if you know parachute well. But what she said to us, which was really key and I think we asked the right question, is and questions that I had never heard people at other agencies ask me when I was in house or ask our clients, was, where do you want to be five years from now and ten years from now? And the answer she gave was, I want to be in every room of the home. I'm going to evolve beyond, you know, soft goods, but I and I don't know how or where or when, but that's like my vision. And I want to create what you believe to be comfort when you are in your home. So the first thing we did was change messaging because right then and there, she was Parachute sheets. You know, and we're like, you are home essentials. You are much bigger than this one product. And we need to start changing the positioning of this brand and of you with Media right now. It doesn't matter if your next category launches in six months or a year from now. And that small change really changed the way Media started perceiving the brand very early on and the way they look at the brand, the way they write about the brand. So for us, we're always like, messaging is key and also knowing the vision and mission of a brand well in advance, because your whole strategy should be focused on that endgame and that exit or that future vision of the brand, whatever it is. And you could see over time, if you look at Press from year one to now, I think I guess it's eight years. I'm not sure.

Nine years.

Yeah. You could see how all the narrative continues to evolve, but it very much focuses on this much wider vision for Parachute as a company that is now like 17 stores nationwide and continues to grow. And their categories have grown. They do furniture, and Ariel is really ascended into this kind of expert when it comes to home and living and how do you exist within the different spaces in your home. So to me, that's been just such a fun thing to look back on, to really see how a brand so young has now evolved into from the Challenger brand to arguably the leader in this category. Which gets us even more excited when we're thinking about the brands that we're about to launch or gearing up for, and to see what the potential is. So that's probably a good one to reference, for sure.

Yeah, I feel like the one thing that you said there about positioning, it may seem like a little thing, but you don't want to corner yourself into a position from where now you're having to have this crazy media narrative to get out of it. And then everyone's like, why are they launching this other product?

That doesn't matter.

So when you're taking things in longer term thinking in mind, you're able to start making sure the positioning and messaging across all those points and even, like you said, to the thought leadership, for example, let's make sure she's a thought leadership in the home, not just in the pillowcase. Right, or something like that.

Exactly. Yeah. Another perfect example of that is recess. When we started working with Ben on recess, which was we launched his product, I remember he sat down with us and he was like, every agency I talked to keeps saying, okay, you're going to be like the CBD beverage. CBD beverage. And he's like, that's not the only thing I want to do. I'm going to do a lot more in this space, and I don't want to be known as the guy from the CBD beverage. And so we really started positioning him as like having him speak at all food and beverage conferences, not just about CBD, but about the food and beverage sector. And since then, he's come out with many different products and merch and doing amazing things in his space. But I remember sitting with him and like, Melissa and I were adamant. We're like, we are not pigeonholing you as like, another CBD guy because he just had bigger plans and we needed to get him to that place. From a media perspective, we couldn't kind of paint him into that corner, especially.

When we knew there would be other brands launching very soon after. That's kind of the world we operate in is we luckily get intel about other things happening in categories, which allow us to then inform the strategies around our brands and making sure that we came out with the strongest, most compelling positioning for Ben and for Recess from the gate. Because he was the first, but he wasn't going to be the last.

Right.

So that's also something you have to consider is I always say brands should always be launching categories that either are about to explode or already exist, but hopefully you have the best and most exciting thing and those are the brands we want to work with. But it's about the messaging, positioning that you come out with which is going to define the success.

I think the other thing there is too, is when we're working with a brand that's launching, that's part of what we know is like something super trendy or something that's happening in the Zeitgeist or in the world or whatever in culture, we know it needs to be more than that. We're not just going to sign a ram because again, CBD was having a really good moment and so it made sense to how do a CBD beverage, like, when we met with Ben, he had and he still has much bigger vision for his brand. So I think you need to be really skeptical of brands that are just kind of hopping on trends, and that's all they're doing. And as Melissa said, that's why when we sit down with potential partners, we always ask, what do you have in mind for year two, year three, year four? What's your ultimate end game? Do you want to be acquired? Are you just looking to raise more and more money? Do you want to? So to know all of those things are really important because we're not here to just get pressed for a given amount of time. We want to help brands get from point A to point B. And if that means getting A, we launched The yes, which was a shopping platform started by Julie Bornstein, and it was acquired by Pinterest last year. And she told us from the get go like, we are creating something super innovative and super great with proprietary technology and the best kind of people in fashion, and this will eventually get acquired. And it did. And it was amazing for her, but we helped her get to that point from a very early point. We said to her, okay, this is your goal. Then we need to make sure that we're hitting a certain amount of business publications in addition to the traditional fashion press every single month. And I would say with that client, we just had a really nice diversity of press every week. We were hitting their consumer so that they were selling product. We were doing some nice b to b stories so that their brands that were on their platform were happy. But at the same time, we were talking about the brand. The yes is tremendous success. So potential investors and Pinterest were reading about that as well while promoting Julie as a thought leader in this meeting.

Yeah. And that's not to say that if your messaging and positioning isn't spot on with your overall endgame from the get go, that you're screwed. We have a lot of brands. We launch a lot of brands. We also have a lot of brands who come to us when they're already in market, and maybe they're a year old, two years old, ten years old. We've worked with kind of every brand at every stage in size. And it never is too late to pivot. It's never too late to evolve. But I think it's even more important that whoever you choose to be a part of that process is very good and experience that change, and that pivot and evolution, because it is something that requires even more of a high touch, telling the right story about that brand and the right publication to get you to that evolution. And that pivot is super key. And I think that's just as important as doing it right out of the gate is also getting it right when you're ready to change, too.

Yeah. Two things that come to mind. One, I think you guys are so spot on about what you said about making sure that. The right people are seeing you. So, for example, the first company that I started, Seated, we'd been building it for a while when we went to New York and we took out all these subway ads and taxi ads and all this sort of stuff, and then everything started to blow up, right? Because all of a sudden, all the investors, all the consumers, everyone was seeing it. And it was like, oh, this is really real. So when you have the attention in front of the right people at the right time, that is crucial no matter how you get there. The other thing that I'd like to really segue into kind of what you guys were talking about in a combination of pivoting and how brands might be going through a little bit of self discovery and figuring themselves out. And also, like, tapping and riding the waves of categories that you guys see a lot of growth in over the next couple of years. So I'd love to jump into what some of those categories that are really exciting to you guys at the moment are and what sort of trends you guys see emerging. Because the consumer sector, it's breakneck pace. Everything's changing every day, right?

Yeah, I mean, Melissa and I have a soft spot for empowering women. Our agency is run by women. It's actually all women at this very moment. I can speak for us both on this specific one, that anything kind of that's empowering women in the healthcare industry is extremely important to me and I think to a lot of women at the agency. There's an enormous amount happening around the path to fertility and motherhood, and there's a lot of really interesting companies that are popping up in that space, whether it's egg freezing or surrogacy. We work with a brand called Nodal that's doing amazing things there. I think women leaders and I think brands that are making these conversations more mainstream and giving women access to more options in this specific area, it's happening all over. You'll read in TechCrunch every day about another one popping up, but to me, it's like the more the merrier, because it's such an important category and something that was really very kind of exclusive and elitist for a really long time. So to me, women's healthcare specifically in the fertility sector, has been something we've been really passionate about professionally and personally.

And we're seeing 100%, I think, that and then even expanding beyond that category, but the broader health care category, I mean, it's no secret, it is completely like being disruptive, disrupted in all areas, whether it's a new company making services for eating disorders easier, or autism, or gender affirming services. So all of those things, I think that's what we're really excited about is when any kind of marginalized community has access to things they need to live better lives in the broader sense. So that we're really passionate about, we're really excited about. I think areas that I'm particularly, actually, Jenny too particularly interested in is more engaged.

It's so comfortable to hear you call me Jenny. I know everyone is very performative. Well, every single person in my life, every single person in my life calls me Jenny. Except for my mother and Melissa. They call me Jen. Yeah. So every time now she's saying Jenny. I'm like looking around the room like, who is this person talking to? Sorry.

It's firmly a performative thing that I only do with external comms, but for consistency's sake. But anyway, we also are very interested in the evolution of the fashion space. Whether it's circular fashion, how do we find more sustainable ways to create apparel. So that's an area we're really interested in. I'm trying to think what CPG is consistently coming out.

Our food and beverage division is always kind of working and signing some of the most innovative and cool brands I've ever come across. I think climate tech is really fascinating. We work with Erico and then I think in sustainability, which is such a like, overarching kind of everyone uses that term, but I think there are a lot of brands that are doing really impactful things for the environment in all different industries, whether it's fashion or beauty or home and design. So that I find fascinating. In the food specific category, though, I do think there's a lot of really small, independently owned brands that are doing really exciting things. And a lot of these brands don't have funding. A lot of them are like a one woman shop, one person doing olive oil or spices. And I think we're seeing a lot of excitement there like not the traditional huge kind of Amazon brands, but these really kind of niche food and beverage companies that are doing exciting things. And it's exciting to see a lot more women in that category too, because traditionally food and beverage was very dominated by men and now you're seeing like, amazing women doing amazing things in that space.

Yeah, actually well, you guys called it when I asked what do you see as the big categories? The first one you said was like a lot of female empowerment. We were just having a pod with a friend who they run the biggest ecom data sort of aggregator. And I was asking him, I was like, what are the they scraped, I think, 500 million products across 77,000 stores. I was like, what products are blowing up? And he's like, the number one product that's blowing up has been period underwear. And in women, female empowerment, these sort of products. So you guys are definitely right on the trends there. And then in terms of the future, right? Where do you see other opportunity? Because I think the tricky thing with a lot of these startups, especially with the environment we're heading into, right, is that you see more and more startups. It almost feels like everyone's, every creator has their own brand, or like, every creator has their own beauty line. And so there's more and more and more competition for the same sort of amount of spaces. So what gets you guys excited when you start talking to different brands and you're thinking about partnering with them on the PR side of things? What gets you guys really excited about saying, this is something that we can work with and this team has a potential to really be big to us.

There's like, three things we look for. The first is a passionate founder. We don't work with brands that are just like, listen, I made this, but I don't want anything to do with it. To us, the human being has to be part of the story. And it's a much more compelling story, obviously, for journalists, if there's a human behind it or humans. So to us, we need to really kind of be inspired by this founder. They need to kind of not be an asshole. They need to be a good person that we're excited to work with. Number two, we really like to work with mission oriented brands. So, as Melissa said, and you said as well, brands that are trying to do something impactful for the world or for specific categories, so they're not just out there to sell another pair of denim jeans. They really want to change something, and we want to be part of that change effectively. And the third why am I bliking on the third brands that make a difference? I was going to say the third is innovation, right?

I was going to say the third, and I say this to actual potential new business, is we have to actually just like it. Like, we want to use it, shift it, wear it, share it. That's the luxury, obviously, of running your own business, is you want to be personally connected to something. So it may not personally touch my life, but it's something that I want to recommend. And I feel really good about being a part of this journey that's very much focused on our value system. So that's the final barrier, I think, is are we just very pumped on it from like, a visceral level, and our team, too, because at the end of the day, you're spending all day, every day talking about brands and pushing their mission forward. Not only do Jenny and I want to be excited about it, but we want our team to be excited about it too and feel great. So I think that is pretty key and I don't think enough people say that, honestly.

I mean, to me, I guess that's Melissa's and I think that's a given, but it's not always I think people.

Find things they generally do not align with just for the patient.

When I worked at other agencies, they would hand me this. Like, I worked at a company and they made sequin dresses, and I've never worn a sequin dress in my life and it was like, painful. But I think the other thing that is really important is the idea of innovation. And when we started talking to you, listen, it's like ten years ago, you could say, like, I have a cool DTC brand that it's launching, and maybe that would be enough back then. Now that's great to have a certain format for selling your product, but you need to be innovative. So to us, when we're meeting with new business, I want to have that like, oh, my God moment. I want to have a moment where I text Melissa on the side and I say, that's really smart. I never thought of that. Because those are the things that we get pumped about, which kind of ladders into what Melissa said and makes us do an even better job if we really are excited by it, if they're making us think differently about something, I've always seen one way. If they are providing something I never thought could be provided, like cabinet Melissa that makes me say, holy shit, I want to be part of this. Because if this is the effect they're having on Melissa and I on a new business call, think of what it's going to do when we speak to an editor at the New York Times or the entire consumer. So I like to have that moment of like, whoa, these people are much smarter than we are.

No, I think that's so important when you're I think being able to be in a position like you guys are, where you're able to work with clients like that. That's the goal, right? Because not only are you going to be able to do your best work, but you're going to be inspired by the people that you work with. And I think this is something that is actually applicable to any business. Like when you get to the point where you're able to say, these are the types of people I want to work with and they align with my values, you're going to do better work. And a lot of times, if you start chasing clients just for the sake of chasing clients, you might get pulled in a totally different direction that ends up where you're not doing your best work. They're not happy because it wasn't like a right fit anyway. And this is something that I've seen with many, not only whether it's software, VC, Create, or whomever, it's like the people who are authentic with themselves and want to do the work that best suits them. The end result is going to be the best.

Yeah, you're exactly right.

The other point you guys made about how important it is to really stand out now, I think that's something that's super important, like you're saying years and years ago, like D, to see it was actually a new thing, right before all brands weren't launching Ecommerce because Ecommerce infrastructure didn't exist. And if you were going direct to consumer, that meant you were innovating by creating your whole you were probably having to build your own website, have your own developers to do it, and that was a barrier to entry for a lot of the other competitors. Now you've got shopify where the de facto way to start a business is oftentimes by starting online and starting direct to consumer as a channel. So when you're looking at it from a PR perspective, like the brand itself and the founders themselves, they need more to that mission than just saying, oh, now we're ready and we're another beauty brand that's ready to be like all the other ones. You need something else.

Exactly. See, you can come work with us. You get it.

I get it. And guys, as we kind of wrap up here, what's next for you guys in 2023? What are some of the trends or maybe projects that you guys are starting to take on that really get you guys excited? And yeah, like, what kind of trends in the overall PR space get you guys really excited about the next couple of years?

We recently launched an affiliate division. I think that was crucial and definitely a big part of our 2023. It's already grown significantly because basically we saw a lot of brands were hiring us to do their media relations and then hiring an external affiliate agency when the two of them really are absolutely married. They need to be working closely together under the same roof, in my opinion, to be super successful. So we brought that in house and it's been unbelievably impactful for the brands that are retaining us for both services. And I think we're going to see a trend of more and more brands wanting to do that based on the results we've had thus far. So from an operational standpoint, that's been really important. We're double downing on our executive speaking division. So that division, which started out as one person just booking our founders for conferences, is now like five people and they essentially work on thought leadership opportunities for founders. And I truly believe that is one of the most crucial part of media relations right now, is getting your founders out there at the right opportunities, with the right people, with the right audience. It's free PR in a lot of ways and it's really impactful for our brands that have passionate excited founders in terms of trends or like what we're excited personally. I mean, we're launching a lot of brands in the next few months, but I can tell you we're launching brands in the healthcare space, we're launching brands in the food space, we're launching brands in the fashion space. But to me, the most exciting thing right now is at JBC specifically. The talent that we have is, in my opinion, and maybe, and I'm not trying to be disrespectful to anyone else, like the highest caliber of Tyler we've ever had, we have people that are coming from political PR, we have people coming from that are experts in sustainability. So we've been able to really kind of open up our hiring process to not just look for traditional publicists and instead look for people that are skilled in different categories that Melissa and I don't know enough about. And I think learning from those people and consistently pushing ourselves as agency leaders to kind of do things differently has been, in my opinion, one of the more inspiring parts of the past year.

I think something more specific to this year and this is more on the brand side. I've been seeing a lot of international brands positioning themselves for launches in the US this year, which I think is really interesting even given the economic climate we're existing in. And these are all consumer brands, which I think for me gives me a sense of positivity and hope that there's obviously new brands launching every day. But when international brands are looking at this market as something that's attractive right now, I think there's something interesting happening there and they're from different categories. It's all across the spectrum of consumer products. So that's something I've been noticing. It's only the second week of February or the first week of February and already seeing so many of those inbounds and that interest in launching them in this market. So that I'm kind of loving.

That's amazing. Yeah, it's something that I've seen as well, a lot more brands with a little bit more international flair that are like I guess it kind of makes sense, right? It seems like a lot of American companies led the charge in that first wave of D to see and consumer brands and then everyone starts to learn and follow after and follow those same models. So it's going to be a really exciting next couple of years coming up. So for any of our listeners who are listening and they want to connect with you guys, get in touch with JBC, where can we find you? Why don't you give a shout out to your socials and where we can get in contact with JBC.

Melissa is like, I don't know what they are. Our socials are all I think instagram is JBET.com. J-B-E-T-T-C-O-M-M. That's where I think we're the most active right now. Although I'm pretty sure our head of content just launched a TikTok channel, which is terrifying considering Melissa and I are both probably too old for TikTok. And then our web website is Jenniferbett.com. Jenniferbett.com, our website actually has had a nice little facelift and is getting relaunched in a few days, which is really exciting for us as well. So those are usually the best ways to learn more about what we're up to.

Awesome. Well, thanks so much for coming on the pod.

Thank you, that was fun.

Thanks for having us. Thanks so much.