Into like the online game 4 years ago. Being a, you know, former infantry, like barbarian and then a teacher, didn't really know much about it. So it's been a steep learning curve. Let's put it that way. So thank God for AI. That's all I can say. Thank God for AI.

Thank God for AI. That's right.

Cool. Alright. Let's roll. Good to go?

Good to go.

321. Hey, folks. I'm sitting down with Justin Lapree. He is the founder of the heroic path to life and is a marine corps veteran and former firefighter.

Start that over. Start that over. It's so heroic path to light.

Oh, I oh, I put life. Oh, man. It's my freaking attention to detail. Attention to detail. Okay. Cool.

It's all good, man.

Frank. Frank. You're a squad leader too. Yes. Okay. Right on. Nice. Yeah.

Same. Oh, I mean, we call them section players here.

But Yeah. Good old ground pounder, man.

Yeah. Right on. Yeah. NCO is leading the way. Okay. That's right, man. Here we go. So 3, 2, 1.

Start that again. Hey, folks. Sitting down with Justin Lapree. He is the founder of Heroic Path to Light, a marine corps veteran, retired firefighter, and mental health advocate for vets and first responders. His personal encounters with a traumatic brain injury and complex PTSD catalyzed his discovery of the life saving potential of endogenic therapy. You'll have to get into that a little bit more later, Justin, on on what that is exactly. And his mission centers on providing holistic alternative therapies to address mental health issues at their core in a legal, secure, and sacred environment within the borders of our own country, meaning the United States of America. So, Justin, thanks so much for taking the time to have a chat on the Hard to Kill podcast.

And let's get right into it, man. What was the what was the reason that you decided to create this organization, this heroic path to life?

Thank you, Dave. Thank you for having me. Thank you to all the listeners out there today, for tuning in. So my why, really, you know, dates back to, when I first ingested a psychedelic compound, back in 22,018. These medicines, were a catalyst in saving my own life after a failed suicide attempt, because nothing else worked in our country. You know, the the United States, has a broken mental health system that focuses on sick care and not health care. And, I was I was on 13 different pharmaceuticals since I got out of the military in 2,005. And those pharmaceuticals were killing me, literally killing me.

Some of them, were super addictive, OxyContin, which, some of the listeners, you know, may have a very intimate relationship with. And I I was told that all of this stuff was gonna make me better. And, it got me so far removed from myself, my family, my children, that, I put a gun in my mouth in 2018, and and wanted to leave. So it really took this first experience in 2018, with mushrooms at the time to have this awareness that there was something else out there that, was was working to bring me back to myself, you know, reintroduce me to that that that boy that was inside of me that had been, you know, tucked away for a couple decades, really wanted these medicines started to help me become connected to my family again, to my children, to myself. And so I wanted to take what I had learned from these experiences over the course of 4 years, and, create an organization, to help my friends, that were struggling. It really it really came down to just helping my friends and families who I I initially started this organization for. You know, I've I've lost 15 friends to suicide since 2,005. It's a staggering number, once too many.

15 is 15 too many. And I look at the kids that are growing up without their fathers. I look at the spouses that are now widows or they're remarried or they're just continuing to struggle with this game of life because of that decision. It's like, man, we failed. Like, we failed them. I failed them. The the the country failed them. The communities have failed them.

Like, the entire system's broken, and the majority of people the majority of people, humans, are struggling. And, you know, we we have the only things that we have to to help ourselves are pharmaceuticals from our doctor that, are there to treat symptoms. They don't treat the root cause. They treat symptoms. They numb yours they they just continue to numb, remove yourself further away from yourself. And then we have, you know, legal legal products that are that are here in this country, like tobacco and alcohol and sugar. Right? So like all of those are legal, and all of those kill us. So I wanted to create an organization to that I can then, you know, really have a structured therapeutic model inside of a sanctuary.

You know, I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of explain what atheogenic means, entheogen. You it's not a term used often. Many people know the word psychedelic. But entheogen comes from the root word, entheos, which, means God within. And all of these molecules, all these compounds, these medicines come from God. Right? They're here they're here naturally. They're here organically. And these these medicines produce non ordinary states of consciousness.

And so I wanted to be able to reintroduce these medicines to our community with the upholding of the sacredness and the reverence that these medicines have been used with since they were found, and they've been used in a in a spiritual religious context since the beginning. Right? They they they found they've they've dated back, you know, mushrooms. They're they're dating back 45000000 years ago. We're we're here we're here on this earth. The the dinosaurs

they were getting they were getting jet? Yeah. They were getting they were getting nice. They were good. Yeah. They're they're they're gonna alter consciousnesses.

I mean, it you know, you you look at evolution and you look at the stoned ape theory and you look at, you know, apes, you know, foraging on mushrooms and their brains growing and them being able to, you know, they became smarter and well, here we are. Right? If if if we if we follow and believe in evolution. But, I wanted to really kinda build out a therapeutic model, kinda blend, the the the ancient wisdom and modern science in a way to where we can work with these medicines in community. Right? We we run 10 person retreats, 10 person ceremonies, but then also have therapists, psychologists, integration professionals, support personnel, alongside them to help navigate the lessons that they learned through these experiences. And so that's what I did. I, I I created Heroic Path to Light, to be something different. I I didn't want, the only access to be out of the country. I didn't wanna force my brothers and sisters who had fought for this country and serve this community to have to go get a passport, go to the airport, go through customs, go to Mexico, Peru, Costa Rica, to go work with something that's our birthright to use in our own very country here.

And so that was the, that was the start of and and the why behind, creating heroic pathway.

It's awesome. Yeah. I love hearing about different models and and different approaches and and and why you got there. And, clearly, the suicide attempt must have been one of those moments that obviously brought you to a different level of, you wanna call it, consciousness, awareness because it didn't happen. And, how if if you don't mind explaining that a little bit more in-depth because I think it's important to the the origin story. You know, what was it that prevented you from actually going through with it and and, you know, then getting on the other side?

So, it was back in it was on Veterans Day of 2018. I was a fireman at the time. I just got off a really bad call, lost the young girl, couldn't bring her back. I was in a divorce. I was my my kids were taken away from me for a period of time. I was in a really low spot. And I I got to the point that it was like, well, if I don't have my kids, what the fuck am I doing here? Right? I have nothing to live for. Right? You know, I'm just kind of going through my gray space, right? It's just like Groundhog Day for me, right? I'm going to work, I'm going to shift, I'm coming home, I'm drinking myself to sleep, I'm waking up, I'm going to shift, I'm drinking myself to sleep.

So I didn't wanna do that anymore. So, I wrote them a letter. It was my final letter to them. My my children were 4 and 1 at the time, and I had it I had it in on my on my truck console, and I had my service weapon that I carried over in in Fallujah with me. And it it was on my lap. I've always kept this weapon loaded. That's what's crazy. Because I never I definitely never wanted to have an unloaded weapon if I needed it.

The last time I shot it was probably about a month prior. You know, around 2 months prior to this in incident, is when my divorce started. So at some point between October 1 November 11th of 2018, somebody tampered with my weapon and then loaded it. And so when I pulled the trigger, I didn't think to check the magazine or check the chamber because I all I always carry 1 with a round in the chamber. When I pulled the trigger, nothing happened. I was really anxious at that moment. I vomited on my lap. I was super pissed off that there was some sort of malfunction.

So I dropped the magazine, and it was empty. And I I I racked back the chamber. It was empty. So somebody tampered with my weapon. At the time I was pissed off at this individual. Yeah. But, you know, looking back, of course, it's, it's it's truly the gift of a second chance is the greatest gift anybody's ever given me. I don't know who that person is today.

I've been really I've questioned my fire crew. It it it had to be somebody on my fire engine or or the truck, at my station. I really don't know. At that time in my life, I really I wasn't around many people. I was really very secluded, isolated outside of the station. So somebody at that station, unloaded that weapon in fear that I was gonna kill myself. And, when I was unsuccessful, I took some time off from the from the station, and I read a book called How to Change Your Mind by Michael Pollan. And that was the first time that I really knew anything about psychedelics.

It was was in December of 2018. I read it in a week. I was super desperate. You know, I was like, listen. If, if there's something else out there, what do I have to lose? If if if if this doesn't work, I'm going to load the magazine myself and make sure that I'm successful. Right. And if it does work, well, my daughter gets to have her dad walk her down the aisle and my son gets to learn how to throw a baseball. And I was like, my children deserve me taking this opportunity to see if this will work.

And, I'm I'm here to tell you, you know, four and a half years later, here I am. And, and and these therapies, were the catalyst in saving my life and wanting my life to be saved and coming out on the other side. It was very scary for me. I'm not gonna blow smoke up anybody's ass. I was scared the first time I sat with a medicine, I was doing it by myself, not advised, but I didn't trust anybody. I was a I was a fireman. We, back then in 2018, we could've they would've fired me if they would've found out what I was doing.

Oh, really? So what I sorry to interrupt you, but what, what was your first if you wanna call it, like, psychedelic drug that that you started experimenting?

Mushrooms. Okay. Mushrooms in 2018, December, 3 and a half grams of penis envy. I I I wore I wore these same headphones, and I had a mantra sleep mask. I I kinda researched what I needed. I was looking into Johns Hopkins University. They provided me a playlist that was, like, 8 hours of music that was, you know, curated by their lead researcher that they were using, in the trials that they were running. So, I took 3 and a half grams.

I put a I was I was in an apartment at the time. I was I was going through a divorce. So I put a camera in the corner of the room, and I just hit record. I was like, well, no better time than the present. Let's see where this takes me. And, about 6 hours later, I was fucking crying. Just just absolutely berserk, overwhelmed with emotion, with feeling, something that I hadn't felt before. I had never cried like this.

And I I I felt like there was a 100 pound rucksack that had just been removed by my shoulders. And I felt lighter. And it was it it definitely captured my attention. I was I felt connected to myself. I had a lot of, you know, I had a lot of regret leading up to this, this moment with this medicine. And I had a lot of grace for myself at this time, when I came out. And so I started to work with that medicine twice a month and I would stair step 4 grams the next time, 4 and a half grams, 5 grams, 5 and a half grams. I would continue to stair step to where I would really lock into my most therapeutic dose was 6 grams.

And I really started to continue to work with this medicine and build this relationship with it and learn everything that that this medicine wanted to teach me. And then I would take that, and I would journal about it, and I would start to integrate these lessons into my life. I didn't even know what integration was at the time. The psychedelic renaissance hadn't started. You know, there was very few chatter. There was very little chatter about, psychedelic therapy and theogenic therapy at the time, But I was integrating, and I was trying to create new habits in my life that were going to better serve me. So I I I really decreased my drinking. I got off of all my pharmaceuticals.

I haven't taken a pill since December 2018. And I have completely transformed into what I believe I've always been. And my traumatic experiences removed me further away from my true self. And, and so now what you are seeing here and now who you're talking to is a much different individual, than I was back in November of 2018 to the point that, almost record unrecognizable, to people who haven't seen me in a while. So as I was going back into the fire station, people were seeing a major shift, and so they started to ask me what what was going on, what was happening, why was I different. So I started to talk about it. And the more I talked about it, the more people listened. The more people listened, the more people that asked me how they could become well, how they could work with these medicines.

And so that was just the the little dots coming together to then form the organization to where people could legally do this without fear of losing their job.

That's, that whole arc of a story. It it begs the question, do you now have that belief that somehow the universe is is calling you for something? Because a failed suicide attempt with somebody unloading your pistol, man, that's like that that gives me goosebumps because

It's epic.

And you still don't know who it is. Obviously, somebody had to have done it. But the fact that that happened because how many other, you know, veterans anywhere between, like, 17 to 44 a day lose their lives from suicide. Right?

That's right.

You had a guardian angel or whatever you wanna call it looking after you. And now because of that experience, I'm sure you had a fork in the road. Right? You were saying, like, well, if this works, it works. If it doesn't, well, I'm gonna be right back here with my pistol on my mouth.

That's right.

But it did work. And so with that in mind, has that given you, like, a stronger a stronger belief that there's a universal force, that there's some some reason for you to carry out your your mission?

Yeah. 100%. So, there's a there's a part to that story. You know, there's a there's a lot in my past, right, that that, that kinda led me to that from, you know, combat to being molested as a child, to growing up in an abusive household, beaten by, you know, beaten by my father. So it was this accumulation of events and and, and moments of time and abuse and abandonment and and trauma that led me up to that decision. Well, when I got back from in 2004, I was an atheist. I didn't believe in God. Mhmm.

Because because where I was at, God didn't exist.

This God doesn't no. I I I had a very similar experience. You know, I was young. I was in my twenties. I'm like, it can't be God, man. Look at this. This is terrible. Why would Dodge ever allow any human being to go through this?

That's right. And so I I was, I was an atheist for quite some time, about 13 years. And I just didn't believe in anything. I was like, there there's there's there's nothing there's nothing after this. Right? We just decompose, and there's no reason for us to be here. Yep. But, yes, with the the the events that have happened since my failed suicide attempt, 100% have, experienced, source consciousness. I've, I feel connected with everyone, and am, certain that God does exist, and God is within all of us.

And so to have this, like, drastic shift of belief to a shift of knowing, for me was very transformative. And so I do believe, I know that this is my this is my sole purpose. This is why I'm here. This is why I was given this second chance so that I can then provide second chances for other people like me that were struggling, right, and provide second chances for the families and the children, right, really, really helping these these these family units come home together again, right, and actually doing something, right, not not just, you know, it you know, I'm I'm I'm really passionate about helping veterans understand that they're very able. Right? We we use this term disabled veteran in this country very loosely.

Mhmm.

And this this Our government is keeping us sick. They're keeping us unwell. And it's like everybody wants to support a veteran, but they step over them on the streets. Right? And it's like, yeah, we you know, what what can we what can we do for the this population? I look at the pot the veteran population, and it's like, could you imagine how strong and I and I think about both of our countries. Right? Do you could you imagine how strong both of our countries would be if the veteran population was well? I mean, you're you're talking about taking, like, 18 year old young men and women, training them to be elite warriors. And then after their time's done, they get a piece of paper, and it's like, thanks for your service. And it's like, I I can't even find a job. And you end up going to the VA system, and you get hooked on pills, and you get hooked on booze, and you you're unemployable, the next thing you know, your life's fucking wrecked.

And I'm super passionate about changing that paradigm. And, you know, I'm super passionate about first responder mental health, as well. This is another, you know, community that's really struggling. It's kind of in the shadows to the veteran. You know, we don't really think of when we think of PTS, you know, we don't really think of the fireman or the cop, right, or the paramedic. We think we always think of the veteran. Right? And that has to do with propaganda and what's out on the news and every, you know, all the Hollywood movies. I mean, how how how many how many war movies have you seen in the past 20 years? So, you don't you don't see a lot.

You don't hear a lot about first responders, but I'm here to tell y'all that first responders are in the battlefield every day, every other day. Yep. And, you know, it just takes some awareness to understand that everybody's suffering, everybody's struggling. And what's out there currently to assist individuals with the treatment of mental health so that they can remain well, Very, very few resources. Yeah. I I definitely

it's yeah. I definitely, I definitely echo exactly what you're talking about here, and this is my my raise on that is to get the veteran community specifically. But a lot of us are cross pollinated in the first responder world. Case in point. You. That's right. Because I have the exact same reason for for doing what I do. If we are able as a community here in Canada is pretty small.

We have about 600,000 veterans, give or take. We have 20 something million.

Right.

But so the numb the numbers are scaled up a little bit. But to take some of the in my opinion, some of the most dedicated, hardworking, devoted, loyal human beings Yep. In your country and to not leverage them is insane. And in my opinion, I'm not I'm not waiting on the government to to fix this. We gotta look out for ourselves. It's us that we need to do the rescue on. So programs like yours are taking action rather than passively waiting to get better through pharma. I'm I I, you know, I I can't stand pharma either.

You know, I always say fuck pharma with a PH. You know, like, the the idea that somehow these pills that are developed in a pharma lab will somehow get you to do the work which is necessary because and I'd like to get into it. What your program does, it's taking action, but it's not just sitting and taking another medication or a

That's right.

Medicine. Right? You have to do work in conjunction with the medication, which is the opposite of what our system is now, which is Mhmm. Hey, buddy. Here are your 15 meds. We don't know what all the interactions do with them because that's that's impossible. We've never done a study on 15 different medications in one human being. So we're just pretending like we know, and you're putting faith in us because we're the medical establishment. And it's a disaster, and I had it in, another, Canadian Armed Forces veteran on Toby who talked about his experience.

He was on something like 26 different meds, and he's having psychotic incidents. And, you know, the worst possible scenario you could you could have, quote, unquote, fully disabled. And then he had a Ayahuasca journey, and now he's gone from 26 to 1. He has, like, a I think it's a blood pressure medication. It's not any kind of psychoactive medication. That just tells me that the way we've structured everything is so broken, and you mentioned it. It's just broken. It's not health care.

It's sick care. So, therefore, there has to be a better solution, and programs like yourselves are breaking that paradigm that, hey, man. You know what? You got busted up. I guess it's SSRIs and sitting at home and waiting to die for you. Thanks for your service. I can't accept that. I can't accept that. And I wanna know a little bit more.

What does your program look like for an individual that shows up and decides, you know what? I think I'm ready to take the plunge. I can't keep on doing what I'm doing now. It's not getting me any better. So what do I have to lose? What's the what's the process look like for a veteran that wants to do that?

Well, first off first off, I just wanna I'm I'm I'm grateful that that we're speaking the same language here, and I'm grateful that that, that you guys in the north are are having the same conversations as what we're having down here. It's super, it's super nice to hear. You know, these big pharma companies, you know, making 1,000,000,000 of dollars in a year, keeping us sick. And it's it's it it has ruined so many so many lives. And they don't care about us. Right? We're guinea pigs. That's that's really what we are. We're guinea pigs.

Right? And, and the people that truly need health care can't afford it. And so they die. And, you know, they don't have the the funds of the resources to get well because everything's so crazy expensive, because they they monetize everything. Right? Everything's a for profit. So, my program, I really wanted to create, I really wanted to create the a program that would be recognized as a gold standard. I was I was seeing people that were leaving America to go to South America, to Mexico, to work with, Sacred Medicines, at different retreat centers. And although the retreat was well done, the thing that was lacking was the preparation and the integration of the community. And people would come back.

That honeymoon phase would, you know, dwindle, and they would spiral out again. And, there'll be I I don't know what happened. I I went and sat with Ayahuasca. They said this was gonna, you know, make my life better. Why am I feeling like this? And, I need to go down and do more medicine. I'm like, no, bro. You you need to start creating some new habits. You need to start, you know, changing your life.

The medicine is not a panacea. It's not a miracle. It's not a miracle pill. It's not a miracle brew. It's not a miracle tea. It's not a miracle fungi. Right? The psychedelic medicine is a tool. That's all it is.

It's a catalyst. Nothing more, nothing less. And if properly supported, if you can properly support the psychedelic experience, the ceremony with preparation and integration, then you are opening up the possibility for successful change. Anything other than that, that is the work, by the way. The work is the prep and the integration. Right? Now the way that we can make changes and get out of our trauma loop is these psychedelic medicines do a great job at resetting our default mode network, creating areas of, you know, periods of time for neuroplasticity, putting a stop to the trauma loop so we can even, like, see our see what trauma that we have from a different perspective. And then and see where we wanna focus our time and energy, and remove habits that don't serve us anymore, and then have space in our lives to then introduce new modalities, new practices, new tools, new friends that are gonna make us healthier and wanna be healthier and really improve our lives. So, my program is 25 weeks long.

Now, I don't say that to scare anybody. It's not like you're you're in rehab. You don't come to us for 25 weeks.

But You're not in a residency for 25 weeks. Yeah.

But but you 24 weeks is done online.

Mhmm.

So you have 8 weeks of preparation. So you have 8 weeks of calls with our trauma therapist, our psychologists, and our integration staff. Mhmm. And these are a combination of 1 on 1 group, 1 on 1 calls as well as group calls. You get our workbook. You get a microdosing protocol. So we work we we have a registered nurse practitioner on staff to where if you are on any pharmaceuticals, we will taper you off those. Really con I'm really concerned about benzos and SSRIs.

Yeah. This is gonna

mess you up if you come off them right away. It sounds like booze. Right? They can kill you. That's messed up.

Booze and booze and benzos will kill you if you come off.

The drug. Insane when you think about it, that they will give a drug.

But it's legal. Is It must it must not be bad for

us. Right? It's part of, like, the standard of care, but it's like, man, you know, and I'm not a doctor. Okay. So let's let's I I think everybody that listens to the show understands, like, we're not doctors. But but just because you're not a doctor doesn't mean you can't reference the research that is publicly available that these SSRIs, in my opinion, based off what I can literally read, do more damage than good, and there's a massive debate on whether or not they should even be deployed, period. That is that is something that has to be discussed, but yet it's like, yeah. We'll get to that. What do you mean you'll get to that? That's like the VA here.

Same thing. SSRIs, dude. Oh, you're depressed? Yeah. SSRIs. Without that kinda idea that, hey. This is a, like, complete human being. Have we thought about, you know, how this affects his sexual health? No. Don't care.

We got one thing to worry about, his mental health, and it will stabilize you, but, also, they don't even talk about, yeah. You can't feel anything after. Of course, you can't feel depressed. You can't even feel joy. Woah. Is that a life you really wanna live? Forever? Because there's no way to get off of it if you just go cold turkey, you'll freaking kill yourself. Anyways, I digress. It gets me fired up because how is that a solution? How is that a freaking solution? Take this drug that probably will get you hooked, and you will never actually get better.

Insane.

And, dude, amen, dude. There's very few doctors that I trust now. Right? I I have my own trauma with with with doctors. But Right. You know, just because you have a degree on the wall, doesn't mean it doesn't mean anything anymore.

No.

It it it it really doesn't, guys. And, I'm I'm all about, you know, whole health, and I'm all about holistic health and and and finding ways that are actually getting down to the root cause of why I have anxiety in the first place. I'm more interested in that instead of taking a pill to make me numb so I don't feel my anxiety. Right? Like, I wanna feel it so I can get through it.

Yes. Right? Yeah. Right? The whole point and that's where I finally came to the realization. I'm depressed. I have, quote, unquote, PTSD, whatever you wanna call it, because it is my body. It's my mind saying, dude, you gotta fix something. You gotta fix something right now. And if not, you're gonna die.

Yep. So That's right. The the depression is a sign you gotta fix something. The the

That's right.

You know, maybe the mania you have is a sign you gotta fix something. But we wanna just oh, no. No. No. No. We don't wanna feel that. No. No.

No. No. No. That's a bad sign. No. It's not, man. Like, it's just having that that framework of knowing that I'm feeling this for a reason. I gotta get through it, but I don't know what it is.

Then you can get the professional help that can actually guide you through there. Or even better, man, like, I found conversations like this I I started my podcast for free therapy. I'll just put that out there.

It's awesome.

I needed to chat with people that were way smarter than me to get that perspective on life that I didn't have. And just having conversations like this with you and then other conversations it leads to has done so much more for me than my therapy sessions or any drugs that I've taken because I'm connecting with human beings and learning. And that for me is the growth that I needed. And it's led me down. Even a few months ago, I read a book, and it completely made my whole world make sense. And I only would have found out I wouldn't have never found out about that book if it weren't for the podcast and listening to what That's right. Recommendations were. And just that alone, that curiosity can go a hell of a long way.

And then in your case, you're bringing veterans and first responders together on-site to go through a very intense Mhmm. Ceremony that I'm sure creates a lot of friendships and bonds that amplifies the recovery. Am I am

I Yeah. You're 100 percent yeah. You're you're hitting the nail on the head. The the the the true medicine here, this is the the the true healing that happens in these types of ceremonies is due to the community. The community is where the healing happens, guys. Healing happens in community. Trauma thrives in isolation. We don't want isolation.

We are trying we have depression because we're not connecting with anybody. We're not connected with ourselves. We're not connected with our spouses, with our kids, with our friends. We are alone. And by bringing individuals together that have a shared experience, I don't care if you fought in Vietnam, if you fought in Korea, if you fought in Iraq or Afghanistan, if you just signed up to join and serve, if you never even saw combat, I don't care if you if you're a first responder, if you signed up to serve the community, you all have this the shared experience of service. You have the same fabric, the same fabric makeup as a human that you would rather put your life on the line to serve a country, a community, or to save the life of a brother and sister. Right? So if you if you put 10 of those individuals, and 10 is what we what we run, but if you put a group of individuals together without anything, without without taking a compound, a psychedelic medicine, that experience alone is healing because they're not alone anymore. And they're they're seen, they're heard, they're respected.

They have a bond without even knowing each other. Without even having met each other before, they will have a bond and be be drawn into each other to learn more because of who they are and the type of individual they are and how selfless they are in terms of service. And so the community aspect is is the that's the magic sauce with this work. We're able to bring in 10 people, they spend 2 months together online building, forging, bonds, relationships, friendships. Their spouses and their family members get a 4 week online cohort of their own called Family Matters.

So

they are getting brought alongside with their loved one, then their loved one flies into Austin, spends 5 days with us. Now, as I bring on Ayahuasca and Ibogaine this year, that 5 days will turn into a longer stay, depending on the number of ceremonies that we're running, but currently, it's a 5 day stay. They'll have 2 ceremonies. We have an equine therapy day. We bring in different modalities and different facilitators for breath work, yoga, movement. We have periods of, you know, we call it a sunrise practice where everybody's in in sacred silence, nobody's talking in the morning, really about just being present and just taking time to ourself. It's so hard to do, even for me. Guys, I'm doing this work alongside with you.

This is a practice, they call it a practice for a reason, right? Right on. But, we, you know, we we bring in whole health, or whole foods for nutrition. So we have a on-site chef, we have body workers, we have a seminar, or we have a a course, a presentation on gut detoxification. Because I'm really trying to clean out the entire vessel here. Now, when they leave, then they go through a 16 week integration program. It's pretty much a 16 week plus plus plus and never ends accountability group. But then they have another 8 weeks of calls. We put them through a 5 week.

We have a 5 5 week program called the found, the fundamentals of, of healing breath. So it's an interactive virtual, program that we've developed. So they go through that. They have 8 weeks of calls. Their family member has another 4 weeks of calls, and then they have a forever community. So that that accountability group never ends. And so if we can stay with somebody from the beginning, 2 months prior, and then stay with them forever. They're they're in our family now.

They always have a place to come back to. They always have somebody they always have an ear to to to listen. They always have a shoulder to cry on, but this is a safe place, a community that's built by us, for us. That is the medicine. That right there is is the community aspect of, hey, wow, there's there's 5 alumni, you know, surrounding these different towns in Nebraska. Man, I'm I'm doing a cross country trip. I'd love to go see, you know, and meet some other individuals that are on the path. Yep.

Dude, hey hey, Justin. How how do I get in touch with them? Well, we have a we have a community page to where they can reach out to different people around the country and then start forging these connections with people. And just by connecting with another human person in in real time, those feelings of depression, those feelings of anxiety, those feelings of isolation will start to fade.

I love, you know, the way you're, you're framing this too. Right? Because I think what happened, especially with the global war on terror veterans as compared to veterans from other generations, they had a much they had a much larger cohort in the example here in Canada. Like, they had the legions. I think you have the legions, some form of Yeah.

The American Legion. Yeah. American Legion and VFW. Yep.

So, you know, my grand my grandfather would go hang out with his bros at the Legion. What we don't have now is anything close to that. We're very separated, very isolated, and we we haven't really created that Legion type experience. But from what I'm hearing, because you're doing this through healing, it's gonna create bonds with individuals that will have a network across the planet or across the planet and, you know, across the United States for sure. And and some of the things that I just want to touch base on on what you said when it comes to, you know, being isolated but also getting healthy again, when it comes to mental health. I don't know where I read it or heard it, but it was based off of some old German research because they were the, you know, granddaddy's psychoanalysis and and psychology. Right. The the the idea of giving somebody a pill was kind of foreign at the I would say because if somebody was coming in with depressive symptoms, they would say, okay.

You're gonna come back in a week, but your homework is you need to go help somebody in your neighborhood and come back and report. And they would inevitably come back and say, oh, I feel a lot better. Because they they were losing connection, and they understood that at a fundamental human truth. You know, putting somebody in the hole. Right? Putting somebody in the hole in in isolation is a punishment for a reason, because it messes you up. But a lot of us do it on our own. Just because it's like, well, I'm not in prison, but I'm in my basement with the lights off or just watching Netflix all day and and not really doing anything, you're essentially doing that and causing a shit storm to happen within the vessels you call it.

And not even being aware of it.

Well, that's the thing. You're not aware that you're

not you're not even aware

of it. You're putting yourself in solitary confinement because it's a fight, flight, freeze response. And if you wanna look at the you know, it's the science behind that reptilian reptilian versus, you know, mammalian brain. And if you wanna nerd out, you can. But if you understand and recognize the pattern as now I'm a lot better at when I start pulling away, that's my go to. That was even my go to before I did anything in the military. If I got kinda stressed out, I would just pull away. I would just isolate.

And so that gets reinforced and then becomes dangerous when you're a bit older and when you have been to war. Therefore, you have to have coping mechanisms and and and frameworks. So I'm glad I've been able to catch myself now. So the instances are few and far between, but when they happen, I don't panic. I don't get freaked out. I don't I go, okay. This is gonna suck for a day or 2, but I'll get through it, which has given me a lot more clarity. Now Mhmm.

On the the the holistic side of things, the fact that you're talking about nutrition, exercise, community, man, we're we're we we've lost the plot so much when it comes to getting folks just back in the game, so to speak Yep. Where we only focus on the mental side of things and not the physical side of who we are. You know, You can't have a a a healthy mind and an unhealthy body.

Well, again so I I wanna just interrupt real quick just because I I really want to educate the viewer here because I've never understood this, and I've just this is something that I learned a few years ago. But do you, Dave, do you do you know how much our gut is responsible for our serotonin production?

Oh, dude. I'm just starting to track this now.

It's 95 It's all of sad, Dave.

Yeah. It's all of it. All of it. I've been reading so much about nutrition and and PTSD, and I was just like, oh, shit. This is a huge component that we're not even

talking about. Why am I taking head meds for 5%. Why don't we why don't we why don't we the fire? We we deep parasite our dogs, but we don't deep parasite us. Why don't we clean out our guts that are producing 95% of our serotonin, but the government is gonna keep us they're due. They keep us unhealthy. There's there's there's, like, 5 fast food food restaurants within a mile from here. Mhmm. Like sugars and everything in this country.

Mhmm.

And it's like, it's it's keeping us asleep. It's it's it's it's making us feel depressed because our gut is toxic. I did. I yeah. This is this is a mind blowing comment. We can have a podcast just on this topic.

This is podcast number 2. This is podcast number 2 for sure. The the the gut mind connection is so important, and so you it's very hard to attack the mind if you don't attack the gut. So diet, nutrition, the physical movement of your body, and sleep. And these are all, like, you know, talking, you know, Kirk about sleep. That's that's basically, like, baseline for me, but you you've got all those components that are required in order to get better. Not, good to have. It's required.

And if if we if we lose that and we just focus on the sliver that is our mind, you know, the mind follows the body. And the other thing I like to say is, like, you know, the I don't know who I got it from, but the body keeps the score.

So That's great.

If if you're having if you've if you smashed yourself for 20 years, you know, military, first responder, childhood trauma, everything, and you've just held it all in, well, there's gonna manifest itself through you, and it's not gonna be good, and it couldn't be chronic disease, whatever. So these things, like, it's it's it's cool to hear more veterans, and I I've said it before and I'll say it again, man. Once I started opening my eyes to the broader veteran world and I started exploring, especially down in the US and, the military influencer conference was huge for this 2 years ago. I went down, and I just didn't know what to expect, but I just wanted to make connections. And no joke, I had about 4 or 5 conversations with veterans that I didn't know, and they're talking about just opening up their minds to psychedelics and and plant medicine. And I was like, that's that's interesting because I was not expecting this movement to come from the veteran world because of our typical, you know, quote, unquote, conservative values. And that whole idea of being a, like, a dirty hippie taking LSD wouldn't jive with us. But what I'm seeing now is that we're the, like, main thrust in the holistic health movement, and it is amazing to be a part of and hearing what you're talking about and all the other folks that are doing amazing work.

This is almost like the it's almost like gorilla tactics right now because we're not gonna be able to crush pharma. That's not gonna happen. What we're gonna be able to do is a groundswell of people that are just not going to need pharma, and that to me is the ideal situation. I just don't need to be on the you don't need to be on drugs anymore. You know? My buddy Toby doesn't need to be on drugs anymore. That's not saying anything to pharma. That's just like, yeah. I don't need you anymore.

Like, fuck off. That will have, you know, a massive effect on society in my opinion. So that's why it's so cool to talk to folks like yourself and hear about what you're doing. Wanted to touch base, just before we, before we wrap up here. You had a cool conversation that has hasn't been published yet with, Tim Jensen from Grunt Style. And the reason why I'm going to bring it up is because that's where I met Tim. I met Tim at this military influencer conference. I had no idea who he was, and we got introduced through this cosmic energy that just united us.

And we started chatting, and we really aligned. And then, you know, Will and and and Drew from the organization were great human beings, and we still talk to them regularly. Drew. Yeah. They were really the ones that really initiated my my curiosity into psychedelics because, again, I see Tim. He's got tats. You know, like, typical, like, military marine corps type dudes. And I'm not thinking

Yeah. Right.

Yeah. You know what, like you know what I mean? Like, I'm not thinking holistic health and esoteric Breathwork

and yoga.

Breathwork. I'm like, woah. I'm like, I'm kinda dabbling in this, but you guys are all in. Okay. Something's going on here. And, so it's really cool to see that you're you're linked up and and chatting about it with Tim. And, what like, how is that for you? Like, you're you're now talking on a, like, a a large podcast with Tim's podcast, chatting about your your mission now. So where do you see, like, the mission going, and how do you see the evolution of it in the future?

So so for first responders, veterans, and their families, we we write healing grants for them. So, it's the it's the country's turn to serve them so they don't have to to feel the financial burden of becoming well. So these programs are free for them. So they apply for a grant, they can they can receive a grant funding for it so that they can come down to Austin and come through this program. Where I really see this going and and, you know, I'd I'd, you know, I'd I'm just so grateful for for, you know, being, introduced to Tim and Tim having some really in-depth conversations with me and, you know, inviting me to to be on the Grunt Style American Grit, podcast. And, we had a great conversation. And, you know, they're right down the road from me. They're in San Antonio.

It took me, like, an hour and change to get there. And I love what they're doing. I love their brand. I love their mission. So it's it's very easy to join forces with them to bring awareness to veterans and first responders that are struggling in this country, and and just to just to the community that wanna support these individuals. So, we're currently gonna be, this is gonna drop on the 9th February. Don't quote me, but I think it's the 9th or 6th. We're running a sweepstakes with the Grunt Style Foundation, where everybody can make a donation of $3, and get their name dropped into a, a hat.

And we're gonna select 3 individuals to come through our 25 week program, which has a value of a 7 to $800 plus the community, which is, priceless.

Priceless.

But yeah. So this is a really good collaboration between Gun Front South Foundation and Heroic Path to Light as we continue to pave the way towards, towards light and really be being a beacon of hope for for individuals, and, the light in somebody's darkest hour. So, you know, I see this really kind of expanding different collaborations with different organizations, you know, in this country, that want to help with the suicide, issue that we have in this country, both on the veteran, the active military, and the first responder, careers. And I, you know, I I see this just being able also why I do podcast in the first place is to be able to reach that individual that's pretty much for me unreachable who doesn't know me, I don't know them, and needs to hear this, and really is debating taking his own life or her own life. I want them to understand that there is hope, that there is organizations like mine out there that are here for you, when you're ready to, to to come down and see us. So for me, there wasn't anything in this country that was accessible. And out of country retreats were unaccessible because I couldn't afford it. I wasn't special forces, so I didn't have a foundation that was gonna sponsor me to go to Peru.

So as a fireman making $24100 a month going through a divorce in a 1 bedroom apartment, I couldn't afford shit. And so I wanted to be able to provide this for that individual. That individual who's living paycheck to paycheck that doesn't trust the VA, that wants to get off pharmaceuticals, that wants to become well, and wants to get back to that person that they've that they've always been. And, this is this is really this is this was the reason that I created it, and I created it with the idea of of healing can be free. It doesn't have to cost us any money. And, and and, you know, I'm grateful for the community stepping up. I'm grateful for our donors, for our supporters that really wanna see this, this organization, continue to grow and build out healing centers around the country and really build these, you know, it's it's a community, right? And I didn't have it. I selfishly built this for me, right? I did not have a community.

I didn't have family. I lost everybody when I went through a divorce. Like, everybody just kinda scattered. And, I was like, man, I I would love to have a community of people that are gonna that are gonna hold me accountable and that are gonna be there when I need somebody to listen. And so by doing this for others, I was also doing it for me because I am very much just like you. And I'm I'm on my path. I'm I'm not healed in in no sense of the word. I think I'll continue to heal my entire life, and and the work never stops.

But my this is my greatest gift. Somebody gave me a second chance and, there's nothing more purposeful than helping somebody else with the gift of a second chance. And so I'm super, super honored to do what I'm doing now.

Powerful words. Powerful words, for sure. Yeah. I'd have to, yeah, second that in terms of, you know, being able to have a second chance and be able to give back in the countless lives that you're gonna be able to affect and the cascade effect of families being able to stay together. Amen. It's just, you know, like, with the ripple the ripples in the universe Yep. Can go on forever and ever. So, love the work you're doing.

So, Justin, let's finish up with where can folks get more information, where can folks reach out. And also for the Canadian listeners out there, is this accessible to them as

100%. Bring it down. Just just make the hey. Show up with some poutine, though. Like, you have to bring down you have to bring down some poutine.

Sec. Hold on a sec here. We gotta clear something up because even Canadians will screw this up. I'm from poutine, like, country. Right? Quebec, Montreal. That's where it's from. So just be careful because you might get some low quality poutine, and I don't want it to represent the country. So awesome.

Hey. What province are you from, bro? Yeah.

And then bring me something for your from your province. Right. Yeah. That's right.

Yeah. Okay.

So, yeah. So please follow us on all social channels. You can find me and the organization personally on LinkedIn. You can find us on TikTok. I know, the organization has a TikTok. I was kinda fighting that.

You gotta get those 20 you gotta get those 20 year

olds, man. We gotta get it. So inst Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, LinkedIn, YouTube. Please subscribe. You know, watch the videos that we're putting out. Watch the testimonials that we're putting out. You can find us right here. Thank you, Dave.

This is our website. We're going through a rebrand right now, so it'll have a little look different look and feel. But please come online. You can apply at the top. At the bottom, you can learn more about what we're doing. If you want to help support this organization and help sponsor a veteran or first responder or family member, to find their lights again, the donation link is is on that website as well. And, if you have any questions, please just drop me a line. Would love to communicate with y'all.

If you or a loved one is struggling, just just please know that this organization is here for you as well.

Right on. That's awesome. I'll put all the links in the description, folks. So if you didn't catch them, then, you can just head to the description and find them there and go support the awesome organization that, Justin's got going on and and support his work, and, yeah, see his mission through. So, Justin, thanks so much for sharing your insights, sharing your story. Yeah. Thank you. Fact that, you're in this space and doing good work.

So in the future, I'd love to hear some updates when you get the rebrand and also to hear all the amazing new success stories that are gonna be coming down this time as I'm sure they'll be coming.

David. Look look forward to talking again.

Right on. Right on. So, folks, thanks again for tuning in, and don't forget train hard, fight easy. See you on the next one. Peace. Alright. Dude, that was an awesome episode, man. We're at, like

Cool, man. Yeah. I appreciate it.