40%, 45% of the american people believe literally in Adam and Eve. Believe literally that the world is only 6000 years old. I mean, that's a shocking figure and you can't duck out of it.

Imagine being able to decipher the history of every creature ever to have lived on earth based on its evolution. Why are men's sect drives so powerful? Why does this peculiar desert lizard have such intricate patterns on its back? And what does it tell you about its long dead relatives? Today we have the extraordinary privilege of exploring these topics and more with one of our greatest living treasures, Richard Dawkins, one of the world's most influential and thought provoking scientists.

Genes are predicting the future because they will not survive unless they get the prediction right.

Richard is a renowned evolutionary biologist, zoologist and author. A prominent figure in the new atheism. Along the other so called horsemen of the apocalypse past guests Sam Harris and the late, great Daniel Dennett. He's well known criticism of creationism and intelligent design.

You can't opt out of science because it goes against a traditional faith.

In our widely ranging conversation, we explore the evolution of sex drive and the aesthetic appreciation of genetics as well as the way genetics intersect in theoretical and experimental science. We talk about the potential evolutionary outcomes of artificial intelligence as it augments humanity. We talk about what it's like to be a scientist and a scholar with a career ranging over 50 years. And we encounter along our journey some of the greatest figures in all of science. I know you're gonna love this episode. So let's go. Richard, I've always wanted to ask you, why is the sex drive in men so strong? I mean, surely we could have gone through the replication of the species if it were 10% less powerful, maybe even 25% less powerful. I mean, what accounts for the behavior in men such that they will copulate with female angler fishes in ways that allow them to be digested or ingested into their female target? Or, say, a male human being who buys a social media app when he already has a quarter trillion dollars and eleven or twelve children.

What is make? What is the reason, the biological necessity that the male sex drive is as strong as it is?

I think perhaps you're misled when you say something like replicate the species. It's not about replicating the species. It's about replicating genes. And genes that are in males have a different way of getting themselves into the next generation than genes that are in females. And because sperms are so numerous and eggs are rather few in number, eggs are economically valuable. Well, endowed with food, sperms are not, and therefore they can afford to be much more numerous. What this means is that in general, throughout the animal kingdom, males can pass on their genes by mating with lots of females, whereas with a female, mating with lots of males doesn't benefit her, because once she's in a mammal, pregnant, let's say, talk about mammals, there's no benefit in mating with another male, whereas in the male's case, once he's mated with a female, there is some benefit in mating with another one, because you've got lots of sperms to go round. And therefore the male sex drive is when there's any difference between them.

The male sex drive does tend to be stronger, males tend to be more promiscuous, tend to be more open to mating with lots of different females. Males tend to be less fussy about who they mate with, etcetera. So that's, I think, the answer. It's about gene replication, not species replication.

And if it were diminished by a few percent, would that affect the relative fecundity of replication of genes? Or is that level that we have it at as males? Does that seem to be a necessity, or could it be diminished a bit?

It varies from species to species. I mean, not all species are promiscuous. In the males, there are many species in which the sexes contribute equally to reproducing and to nurturing the young. And that's different. I mean, different species differ according to their ecological circumstances. So you're talking about diminishing. Yes, it does happen. It happens.

In some species, monogamous species, it is diminished. Yes.