Hi. This is Paul Zellizer, and welcome to the Awarepreneurs podcast. On this show, we dive deep into wisdom from some of the world's leading social entrepreneurs. Our goal is to help increase your positive impact, your profitability, and your quality of life. Before we get into today's topic, I have one request. If you could hit subscribe and do a review on your favorite podcast app, it helps more people learn how to have positive impact through a values based business. Thank you so much. Today, I am really honored and really excited to introduce you to my colleague and a new friend, Carla Cassie.

And our topic today is supporting the growth of black businesses. Carla grew up here in Albuquerque, and then all the way through going to the University in New Mexico, worked at Sandia National Labs for 25 years, did HR and contract work, and then worked with the public utility in New Mexico called PNM. Carla thought she retired after all those great years doing awesome work. And then in February 2022, got a call. Hey, Carla. We need you to come be president of the Black Chamber of New Mexico, which is the role she currently serves in, in which we met. She's doing incredible work, and they are doing incredible work. Carla, welcome to the show.

It's an honor to have you here.

Hello, Paul. And thank you so much for having me.

So there's so much we could talk about, but before we get into the actual topic, the strategies you are doing amazing things to help the black chamber and to help black businesses in New Mexico. What would somebody wanna know about you and the work you've done that would give them a better sense of who is this person that is doing this grace work?

Well, I grew up here in Albuquerque. And even though I've traveled all over the world, this is home. And I always love to come back home and help anybody that I can. That's just what my heart is is to be of help to anybody I can however I can help them. So, you know, I did it in corporate America, but it was real different working in corporate America because you had funding and you had everything else coming to a tax exempt organization is a whole different world.

Yeah. And, and the listeners, if you've been around listeners, you've heard me rave about New Mexico and Albuquerque and how we're not exactly like the mainstream US in quite a few ways. What if somebody wasn't super familiar with New Mexico, the context that this great work is happening in? What would you want a listener who didn't know anything about Albuquerque or wasn't familiar with New Mexico? What would they need to know to sort of understand the context that the businesses you're supporting operate in?

So we operate in an environment where we try to make everybody feel included, not only included, but we want them to feel like they belong to the community. And so that's what our goal is, is to make them feel at home, not just have a seat at the table, but have a voice at the table as well.

And I can speak from personal experience. We met through a mutual colleague, Sarah Branch of the SBA. I was the business coach for an accelerator. And Sarah and Carla have a long standing relationship. And like, you walked in, Sarah lights up, and you 2, like, run across the room and give each other a big hug. Like, if you don't know Carla, like, Carla walks around hugging almost it's a it's a remarkable how many people know you and how your presence is just there's so much warmth and care. Each person in front of you is like the only person on the planet. It'd be a way I see you operate, Carla.

So it's not just a theory. I've seen you do this, and you're it's one of your superpowers, helping people feel included in, like, what they have to say matters.

Well well, thank you. I appreciate that. It's something I've worked hard at because I didn't always feel included. And so, because I didn't always feel included, I wanted to make sure that anything that I did and anybody that I was around that they felt included and they felt important and they felt a part of it because I had instances where I didn't feel that way, both in, you know, going to school and in corporate America. I didn't always feel included. I didn't always feel like I belonged. And so I've tried to change that scenario.

Yeah. So we're going to get into the strategies you use at the black chamber. But before we do that, like, what would you say are some of the challenges that like, it's not easy to be an entrepreneur to be any kind of entrepreneur. And, and then if you add different values, like you're not just trying to make money, but you're trying to like do something good for your family and the community. Like it's a little harder, right? And then if you're a black business owner, the research tells us that's even harder. There's some extra friction to success. If somebody's listening to this, and they might have some idea, like our listeners, that wouldn't be the first time they've heard that. But maybe they're not as familiar with the day to day experience or the research as you are, what would you say are some of the key points that the black chamber is working over calm that are specific to black business owners, that somebody that looks like me wouldn't necessarily be subject to in trying to grow a business?

Well, we're trying to change mentality and culture and changing culture is difficult. And so it's something that we have to bring to light all of the time, but we try to bring it to light in a positive way and not ram it down their throats. So we live in a state that is typically called tricultural, And we try to let them know there's more than 3 cultures in New Mexico. And so we try to make sure that they realize the importance of of everybody being included. And so today I did a keynote address for the US citizens and immigration services department, and they wanted us to talk about immigration and how it affects the black people and perceptions and those kind of things. And one of the things we said to them today, which was a shock to them, is that Africans and black people were here long before Columbus. And one of the major reasons that they know it, it was in Columbus's own journals talking about the black people that were already here. So we talked about the migration that happened early on.

We talked about the migration that happened that was forced migration, which is the slavery. And then we talked about voluntary migration. And so I think people have a lot of misconceptions and their perceptions are tainted and so we're trying to do the education to make sure that they know that their perception may not be right. Here's some actual facts to help you out.

Yeah. And and to just go back to what you're saying, that tricultural frame. Right? Again, if you're not from New Mexico, you might not have what does that even refer to? Right? So the tricultural frame, which is something that for a long time got taught in schools in New Mexico. You hear public officials still sometimes using it. Tricultural refers to Hispanic culture or Latinx culture, to white culture or Anglo culture, which is oftentimes called here in New Mexico, and indigenous or Native American. Those are the 3 cultures that are constantly referred to here, and you heard listeners excuse me. You heard earlier, Carla say she was born and raised in Albuquerque. Right? So imagine what it's like to grow up in a place that's talking about the incredible tricultural heritage of New Mexico, and you're not from any one of those cultures.

I know you were born and raised here. Just trying to give you a sense of the complexities of the kind of issues you're facing given that you are now the president of the Black Chamber of New Mexico. And I would say as somebody who's lived here, I'm a New York Jew originally who moved here in 1993, I find New Mexico to be more welcoming in many cultures than most places. But even here, you can imagine what it would feel like to grow up in a place that literally doesn't even officially recognize that people of your culture are are rooted in the state and there's a community here. Is that fair to say,

Carla? That is absolutely right on. That is an actual depiction of what it really is like. I love New Mexico. I love the people. I I and I always come back. But but it is difficult sometimes when you're still facing that after all of these years. Yeah. So And you didn't have a lot of black slaves in New Mexico because they had enslaved the indigenous people.

And so they were the slaves in this area, but thank God they're now getting reparations and things they deserve. And I'm glad to see that happening. They rightly deserve it. I just want it to expand just a little bit more.

Absolutely. Thanks for bringing that in. So in that context, certain official agencies don't even recognize that there's a black community here, let alone make it a priority to help black families start businesses. Right? So in that context, give us a sense of the black chamber. Like, when was it started, and what was some of the conversation as best you understand? Like, why was it started?

My understanding is this is actually the third one that has started. So the other 2 failed. This one started about 5 years ago this in March. I just became the president July 1, 2022. When I took over the chamber, it was the African American Greater Albuquerque Chamber of Commerce. So we just concentrated on the Greater Albuquerque area, But after only being here 4 months at that, we have way too much to offer to just offer it to the greater Albuquerque, talked to the board of directors, and we went and we changed our name officially with the state, and we're now the Black Chamber of Commerce of New Mexico. But one of the things we run into real often is we hear we're not significantly we don't have the statistics to make us significant. And so it's like, wait, they say we're statistically not relevant.

And so we're trying to let them know that we are relevant. We have something to offer and we are just trying to collaborate with everybody so that they know that we are here. We have something to offer and we're important as well. Yeah. Even if we're not the majority.

And one of the things we talked about before we hit record, Carla, is, you know, to go from that the official organizations don't even recognize, don't even talk about or or when they do talk about it saying the black population isn't statistically significantly oh, makes my blood boil. Hear that. Right? Mine too. Yeah. I can imagine. And to go from there to one of the superpowers that you have is creating partnerships with some very high leverage people and institutions in New Mexico. Like, when I think of your name, I think of somebody who's, like, super high level skill set as creating partnerships. So tell us a little bit about how did you take an organization that failed a couple of times, that official organizations are, like, basically saying, oh, well, it's such a small portion of the population.

It's not even worthy of attention, and we'll get into what some of these partnerships look like to the extent that you can share about them. But you're creating some really incredible partnerships. You already have some, and I'm privity some conversations. There's more coming about that we can't quite talk about yet that are very high leverage with very significant organizations in the same state that's officially saying the black population isn't necessarily significant enough percentage to allocate resources to. Like, how did you do that?

You know, I I actually go to their events. When they have events, I show up. And I show up and I'm there and I'm there and I support. So I think that's the first thing is you have to go. You have to be there. You have to support and you have to let them know I'm here to collaborate. And so when I go to major corporations or governmental agencies, whether they're city, state, or federal, It's one of the things that I don't just go with my hand out trying to get something from them. I talk about how we can partner and how we can share with them and what I can give back to them.

So they may have the money, but I may have a resource. And so it's like, how can we work together and collaborate? We have too many people that need our help, that with all of us working together, we still cannot support everybody. And so that's how I go into every situation is how can we work together to better New Mexico and better our economy, better our small businesses, make them more sustainable economically, which then helps them.

Again, I'll give a story. This just happened Friday night. You invited me and my girlfriend. We went to a basketball game. It was awesome. What a close game. Right? I think the score was a 105 and a 100 to a 108. And the new message team lost, but they were in it till the very last moment.

It was such a great game. And in that game, you introduced me to some partners of yours, and we're going back and forth by email. We're gonna have copy. Right? But, like, you came up, gave me a hug, and then said, hey. You intentionally brought us together and said, you 2 need to talk, and we're gonna do that. So that's an example of, a, being at events. I just had a conversation with a group that wants to mentor CEOs and help them get access to resources. And it's a great organization, but nobody in New Mexico outside of a very slim bandwidth folks know they're there.

And that was one of my representing their business or another board they're sitting on, they're talking about that, but nobody's in the room talking about your organization and shaking hands and doing what you just described, Carla. And she's like, Yeah, you're right. I don't like to hear it, but that's not our strong point. And she's like, What do we need to do to get to build relationship with these organ I'm like, you gotta be in the room. New Mexico is a very high touch person to person kind of a place, and and I've seen you in action that way. And I just wanna highlight how good you are at that. And the question, if I'm a listener, Carla, then is, like, how do you manage time and energy like to be at events and shake hands and think about collaboration when you're also trying to do the that none of that's probably in the job description or a billable hour kind of a thing. And then you've got the the work that you're actually there to do, running chamber events and, you know, getting resources into your members' hands, and it's time for annual billing, and you do the billing.

Like, all that's what you get paid to do. How do you balance that kind of networking and relationship building with the actual work that you're there to do as an organizational leader or as a business owner?

Thank God I've never required a whole lot of sleep. And this is not something that I recommend. Matter of fact, I actually teach the opposite of what I have been doing the last 19, 20 months, 19 to 20 months because I don't think I've had a day off since July 1st, which is not good. And it's not something that I recommend, but sometimes when you're laying a foundation, it requires that kind of framework. And then once the foundation is laid and then you'll get all of the other assets and people and everything else, And then at that point in time, you can relax a little. I do want to say that I have a great team and I call them the dream team And we work together so very well. I have a great board of directors and they are very and that kind of thing. And so I, I, I have to depend on them.

I have 3 successful adult sons that I can get some advice and stuff from them sometimes as well to make sure, because I want to always be relevant. And so I wanna be relevant to the younger generation as well. And it's just those different kinds of things, but I've never required a lot of sleep. And so that's why probably I can do everything that I'm doing.

I've heard it called the startup sprint. Like you work really hard, right? And sitting over here and, again, tell me if I'm wrong or I'm missing something. The Black Chamber has recently expanded, like you said, officially expanded, rebranded, and now it's a black chamber focused on the entire state of New Mexico, not just the greater Albuquerque area. And I saw the website. I remember when I was first introduced, I tried to do my homework. I go to the website. And on the old website, if I remember correct, the only picture on that site when you went to the about page was you, like a welcome from the president. And the new website has your board, has your dream team.

Like, it is a full representation of what you're talking about. And I'm wondering if you would agree. When I work with startup founders, it's oftentimes, okay, you might need to sprint. You need to it's kinda like getting the flywheel effect. You need to get the flywheel moving, and sometimes that takes more effort. But once you get it up and running, to keep sprinting like that is it's called the sprint for a reason, and I'm literally an ultra marathon runner. So when people say it's a sprint, I mean, it's a marathon, not a sprint, I literally run marathons, you know? So, like, you cannot I cannot. Very few humans can maintain a sprint pace over a marathon distance.

It's a guaranteed way to get hurt. Right? And I think our our nervous systems and our just metabolism, we can do harm to ourselves if we try to sprint for too long. And oftentimes, when we kinda get past a sustainable sprint as a startup, the way to build more support and sustainability is team. And I'm watching you do that, like, literally right now. Is that fair to say?

That is very fair to say. It's also fair to say that I know when I am hitting a point and then I know I need to take a vacation. And so last year I actually told the board, look, I need a break. I left and flew to Dubai and flew there by myself. There was a group of us that were supposed to go together. They couldn't go. I was like, I'm still doing it. I was in Dubai for 10 days doing whatever I wanted to do.

I rode dune buggies in the desert. I rode the camels. I took a 25 minute helicopter ride above Dubai. I some days I just sat on the beach. And so even though I go go go go go, I know there are times when I have to say stop. I need to regroup. And regrouping and reframing is so very important.

I love the image of you on a camel and doom buggies. And I'm so glad you had that. That's awesome. So let's do this in a minute, I want to come back and get into a little bit more of like what the chamber offers and some of the strategies that you use. Before we do that, I just want to take a quick break and hear a word from our sponsor. Are you facing 1 or more important decisions in your impact business? And you'd like an experienced thought partner to develop a plan about how to proceed in the complex times we're living. But you don't feel the need for an extended coaching or consulting contract that's gonna cost you many 1,000 of dollars. You're looking for an affordable, targeted, and time efficient type of support.

Through paulzelloser.com, I offer a strategy session package. These packages are ideal for entrepreneurs who are facing 1 to 3 immediate decisions, like how to increase your positive impact, fine tune your marketing strategies to get more results for less effort, launch a new product or service successfully, or refine your pricing structure so it's both inclusive and provides you with a great quality of life. You can find out more by clicking below, and thank you so much for listening to this podcast. So welcome back, everybody. We are here with Carla Cossy, and we are talking about supporting the growth of black businesses. Carla is the president of the Black Chamber of Commerce of New Mexico. Carla, such a great conversation. Again, thanks for being here.

Let's get into the details. In the second part of the show, we like to, like, dig in a little more granular. So if somebody doesn't know what the black chamber of New Mexico does, give us an overview. What does the black chamber do?

So we are here to help now while I do target black businesses, I help other underserved and under resourced businesses as well that don't have a place to go to. Because at one time, we didn't have a black chamber to go to, so I try to recognize others as well. And one of the groups is the Deaf Cultural Center of New Mexico. So the deaf community is underserved and under resourced. They came to me. We helped them write their business plan and then they were able to take it to the city and get affordable housing. And so we do those kind of things. We have a small business success program here at the chamber.

You have to be a member of the chamber and you must live in New Mexico. Other than that, it's pretty much open to what you need in order to be successful. So you can come to the chamber and say, hey, I'm thinking about starting a business and we help you from the ground up. Or it can be, I have my business, but I don't have a website. Well, I have grants and contracts that allow me to pay a consultant to develop a basic website for a business completely free of charge as long as they're a member of the chamber. They don't have a business plan. We help them write a business plan. If they don't know accounting, we put them with an accountant so they know how to do their books, so they can file their taxes.

We do all of those kind of things. And so what I do is we give them a form and say, okay. Here's some basic information that we have to have, that we have to report, but tell me what it is that you need. Do you need to be a certified business? Do you need to get certified as a woman owned business, as a veteran owned business, in a HUBZone? Whatever it is that they need, we try to meet them where they are and help them get to the next level.

I love that. So rather than here's our menu of 4 things, choose from 1 of you, like, Hey, welcome. Let's get to know each other. Tell us what you need. And it's really meeting listening to what they need and then working hard to meet those needs. Is that fair to say?

That is correct. I look at all of them as they are customers of the chamber. We exist for you. If we didn't have customers, there would be no need to have a chamber.

Yeah. And give us a sense, Carla, like what's the scale? How many members are we talking about at this point?

So when I took over, we had about 60 members. We have over 300 members now and it's growing, daily. And one of the reasons why it's growing when I first took over, we helped everybody. And I said, okay. So what's what's the benefit of being a member? And there wasn't really one. So I sat down and I said, okay, let's brainstorm and say, okay, There has to be some membership privileges. And so we developed a whole program to say, if you're a member at this level, these are the privileges you get. And so one of the things I've done, also, I learned it in Chamber of Commerce training, is I put together a 2024 membership sponsorship blueprint.

And so I send it out so I'm not going back to corporations every time I have an event and ask them to help me out. I send them something once a year. They look at it. They decide their level of membership, their level of sponsorship, and they know they don't have to worry about me coming back again, asking them again and again and again. And I just started this program in February because I learned about it in January, and I'm already getting great positive feedback on that. So I'm a forever learner. I go somewhere, I hear something and say, okay, how can we take that, use it, bring it back to New Mexico and make it work for us.

The listeners pay attention here from 60 members. And you said July, and we're recording this in February. So I'm gonna call it 18 months. Right? From 60 members to 300 members. Right? 5 x increase in 18 months. Most organizations, if they get a 5x increase in a decade, would be shouting it from the rooftop. So, you know, you get a sense of, like, who Carla is and and how effective this can be, this approach that you're talking about.

It's because we have a team of people and we're saying here's what we have to offer you. And I think when people realize that there's something you have to offer, then they're willing to come and be a part. Before there was ambiguity about what does it mean to be a member? Now we've taken that ambiguity away and now you know what you get for being a member. So we are offering 35 classes between February December. We have 8 more networking events that we're having and all of the other things that we will do in between. So we offer a lot of training, a lot of mentoring, a lot of networking, and then we do the 1 on ones with them as well. And so it is giving them something to help them grow and be sustainable.

Yeah. And give us a sense, Carla, like those classes, you don't have to give us all 35, but give us a sense, like what kind of classes are we talking about?

So so we have a variety of classes that we are offering, and a lot of it is based on what we have heard on membership say they want and need. So we have a lot of nonprofits that are coming in. So we're gonna offer some classes with the help of our friend at Meta for our nonprofit group for how to raise funds if you're a nonprofit. Our CPA is gonna come and talk about taxes for nonprofits. We do a lot of courses around financial competency. When I came in, they were all talking about financial literacy and I said, no, we have to change the language. I don't want people to just be literate. I want them to be competent And so we have different of our financial institutions that come over and teach about how to obtain capital when what you need to do with that.

We do classes on AI, on cybersecurity, on just basic contracting. We have 4 classes this year on how to become certified and then how to secure a contract from the government. So you name it and and we have it. So we have a whole lot of but we have 35 different courses that we're we're doing home ownership because we're trying to close the generational wealth gap through home ownership. So we have somebody coming over and talking about that. We have partnered with a couple of credit unions where they have loan officers that they have dedicated to the chamber to help people in 3 to 5 years be ready to purchase a home. We are just trying to expand the reach.

It's awesome. It's awesome. And one of the things you're talking about, again, just a little nuance about the New Mexico economy, you're talking about getting certified as a win women owned business or a vet veteran owned business, things like that. It's a certification that's put out by the US government. And if you get that certification, it there's certain mandates with federal contracts to hit certain thresholds of certified businesses, either women owned business or veterans, minority owned businesses. If you get that certification, it allows you to get extra points on your application, and it can be a game changer. In a place like New Mexico, we have Los Alamos National Labs and Sandia National Labs and Kirkland Air Force. A larger than average portion of our economy is coming from various federal sources, and so there's a lot of contracting.

And if a business owner, whether they're doing catering or construction. Right? There's contracts for almost anything you can a lot of things, for tech, so many different for, you know, different kinds of supplies that people need from office supplies to computers. So if you get certified, it allows you to I I've seen businesses grow 10 x in one contract by being able to get those certifications, which increases their attractiveness for those contracts. And suddenly, you see a business that was 3 people go to 30 and and then grow from there to a 100 or 300. So it can be a game changer for those that can access those certifications and know what to do with them. Is that fair to say?

That is fair to say, including 8, a, which is big, but another one that most people probably don't know about and you can become certified as a black business. So the US Black Chamber of Commerce has worked tirelessly in Washington DC and we can now help you get certified through a program called the buy BY BLACK, buy BLACK through the US Black Chamber of Commerce. Right now, it's completely free of charge, and you can become certified. And then you are in a database where you can receive contracts from all over the country, even living here in New Mexico, like so GSA, and some of those are some of the largest contracting opportunities and you can get them and we can help you get certified even as a black owned business. Because one of the things we found out is the minority classification over 70% of the dollars were going to white women owned businesses because women were considered or still considered a minority in the US government. So the dollars weren't going to the necessarily the underserved and the under resourced. And so we were able to go and get another certification that is called by black. So you can get certified as a black owned business and then be able to get additional contracting opportunities.

Very cool. I didn't know that. And I'm gonna put a link in the show notes. Course listeners, there'll be a link to the Black Chamber of New Mexico. Go check it out. But, also, I'll get a a link for the Buy Black program, and that'd be available to anybody in the US to apply.

Available to anybody in the US. And if you go on my website, I do have a tab for the US block chamber of commerce, and there is a link right there on that, and they can go there and they can get certified as a black owned business.

So you've got informational programs. You're helping people in some very tangible business related, whether that's how do you read a p and l or you don't have a p and l, you need an accountant to, you know, get you a p and l. But then there's things like homeownership and thinking a little bit in a larger context than only specifically what's happening in the business, but about the well-being in a holistic way of your members. And is that new? Is that tip I don't hear most chambers include that. Like, where did that come from?

You know, it it's new. And I it came from I served on a task force with the mayor's office. And when we were going through all these different things in one of our sessions, we asked people to raise their hand and it was probably 40 or 50 different black organizations. And we asked them to raise their hand if they owned a home. And we were so shocked that the numbers that do not own a home. And so we began working on a lot of programs to try to change that because we know we can close generational wealth gap through home ownership. So it's not just about a handout. It is let me help you to become better and to help and be able to help generations to come.

And one of the other things we're doing, we're creating a resource page, a hub on our website. So my web designer is working on that now. So there's gonna be a resource hub. And so if you want to work with the city of Albuquerque, there will be a page dedicated to the city of Albuquerque. So if you wanna be a vendor, you wanna know about their job training programs, you can do that. So we're doing it with the city, with the state, with hospitals, with Los Alamos, with Sandia, with the SBA, with you, US black chamber, all of them, because we want them to know about resources that are available. Because that's one of the things we found out after COVID that so many of our businesses didn't survive because they didn't know about available resources and they hadn't built relationships with banks and financial institutions to get what they needed. And so that's what we're trying to do is build those relationships.

Right. And again, listeners, 18 months ago, a lot of this wasn't there. Right. So just a deep out of you, Carla. And if I'm a listener, we have listeners all over the world, definitely growing in New Mexico, but for a lot of years, nobody in New Mexico knew who I was or that this podcast even missed it. I'm trying to change that, trying to help the world learn about New Mexico and New Mexico learn about this greater social entrepreneur movement that's happening all over the world. It's so exciting. Right? But if I'm in a place that doesn't have this kind of resource, right, it doesn't have a chamber like this.

And I'm a part of and deeply passionate about helping any marginalized community. I mean, recently, I was talking to a group that works with, you know, young women in Afghanistan, which is a very challenging situation right now to be a smart young woman in Afghanistan. Right? So many folks dealing with incredibly challenging situations, listen to this podcast. And there might not be a business organization like what you've created with the black chamber of New Mexico. If I'm somebody listening, I'm like, I wish we had that here. Give me some tips. How can I be part of getting that here for my people, wherever here and whatever my people look like that aren't currently being well served, what would be some initial steps that I could take if I'm that person?

So that that's an interesting question. That's one I've not been asked before. And and I have an answer probably for the United States, but I'm trying to think about what happens in a place other than United States, because, you know, as I said, I used to do a lot of missions trips to Uganda and Uganda is probably the poorest country in Africa. So I'm trying to think Yeah.

We we have listeners in Zimbabwe and their economy is falling and Argentina and their economies are falling apart. Right? Like

And and I'm like, how how could we help them? And, you know, I started out my missions trip kind of thing. I started out by just sending money to help girls go to school in Africa because I found out that if money was short, which it always is, the girls weren't able to go to school. They had to stay and work, and that money couldn't be used for that purpose. So I started out by just giving money so these girls could go to school. And then from there, the passion grew, and so I started going over and taking supplies and and doing things to help out. And and and I go over and do leadership training for their leaders that were there. And I did all of that personally. It was not, you know, a group kind of thing.

So I think those of us who have some privileges, I think we have to be willing to give back to those areas that don't have those privileges. And, yeah, this is a hard one.

It's a hard can can I try something? Because I think Yeah. I think you do something, but tell me if this is wrong. But I think watching you at the black chamber and listening today, I think one thing you do is you you show up, you find a way that's that's want you don't force yourself. That's not who you are. You find a way that's wanted to show up. And then you listen. Just like you said, when people come in and like, okay, here's what we've got right now. But what do you need? Like, tell and then you work to find infrastructure and whether it's a 1 on 1 meeting or a course on cybersecurity or, oh, well, look at how few people own homes.

So now we're gonna help, you know, people from our community find pathways to homeownership, even though that's not necessarily what most chambers would say is top of mind. You asked hard questions and then listened and then went back and talked to some power players and say, here's what my community's dealing with. Is that is that a fair summary?

I think it is, and I think it's all about partnership because one of the things that we've done when you mentioned that is I've partnered with a couple of agencies here that have refugees coming into the city. And, you know, real often they speak very little English. They may have degrees, but their degrees aren't recognized here in the United States. And so we do things to try to help them get incorporated into the community, get some jobs while and get some place to live while we're waiting to make sure we can do something with their education so that then they can be successful. But that's when they're here. I'm trying to think about how the chamber can help more when they're not in the United States. And that's the tough one for me.

The tough not to crack. I, any way I can be of support. I feel a lot for folks in some pretty tough situations, whether that's due to climate or some government tensions or economies failing. Like I have personal connections in places where that's very much top of mind.

You know, I would like to share one thing, one of the things I found out and it's again about knowing about resources. When I was going to Africa every year, I found out that Delta Airlines, since I had the 501c3 and those kinds of things, I could show on my documentation, Delta Airlines paid for all of my luggage because I took lots and lots of things that I was taking and leaving in Africa. Delta Airlines waived all of my luggage fees, and it was something I found out quite by accident that it's that that's available. So there's some things available and that's what my mission is to find out about all of those resources that are available and then share them.

Beautiful mission. So Carla, give us a sense, like 3 years down the road, you know, you've only been at the helm for 18 months and a lot's happened. But if you look at, I'm gonna just toss out 3 years. What do you think the black chamber looks like? How have you grown 3 years from now?

You know, I told them when I took over that I would come and I would stay for 5 years since they grabbed me out of retirement that

I planned to leave the space for 5 years. Retirement.

I but I I don't think that's gonna happen. I I have my my board and my adviser saying, no. You're not going anywhere in 5 years, but I'll have to have some some more help in that kind of thing. But I see the chamber as being a resource not only in New Mexico, not only in the United States, but I see us expanding into Africa and different areas of the world to be able to help out. We have too much to offer to keep everything here. And so that is my goal is to keep expanding. And my relationship with the US Black Chamber and with the Small Business Administration has afforded me so many opportunities. So last year I was actually at the white house twice.

And, and, and it's just opportunities that are available when you go out and you're willing to sit at the table and talk and help. I found out that the SBA here, the regional SBA office had recommended that I go to the White House. Well, I was already in DC at a meeting, and I got an email and it said invitation from the president of the United States. And I said, yeah. Right. This is scam. And I went down to my meeting with US black Chamber, and they said I better have one too. That's real.

And so I think when you get out and you work and you do, then you get more opportunities and those opportunities lead you to be able to help more people in more places to do more great work.

Absolutely. Carl, I could hang out and talk to you all day. I love what you're doing. I love talking to you. I know you're busy. I know our listeners are busy. So as we start to wind down, if there was something that you wanna leave our listeners with or something we haven't talked about yet that feels important, obviously, we're gonna put links to the site. Go check it out, listeners, and come move to New Mexico and hang out with Carly because New Mexico is awesome and I love it.

But if there was something that we haven't talked about that's important to understand about the black chamber or just something you wanna lead people with as we start to say goodbye? What would that be?

I want to live with a quote by James Baldwin, and he said nothing can be changed until it's faced. And so my feedback to the world is if you want to change something, you have to face it first. And when you face it, you can change it.

Beautiful way to end. Carla, thank you so much for the work you do, and thanks for sharing it on the show today.

Thank you.

My pleasure. The listeners go check it out. Go check out the site of the Black Chamber of Commerce of New Mexico. Tell your friends. Let's get the word out like we do on this, especially about that buy black program. If you haven't heard of it, and you're not in New Mexico, you can still reach out. But definitely, that's something that I'd love to see us as a community amplify. Tell your friends.

Go get the information. This is an incredible program and incredible opportunity. Before we go, I wanna remind you, we love listeners suggested topics and guests. So if you have an idea for a guest or a topic, go to the AwarePreneur's website. Go to our contact page. We have 3 simple guidelines. We try to be really transparent. Go check that out.

And if you feel like it's a fit, pitch us an episode. So as we say goodbye, I wanna say thank you so much for listening. Please take really good care in these intense times, and thank you for all the positive impact that you're working for in our work.