What's going on? Welcome to today's episode of uploading. Today we have the pleasure of talking with Chase Barmer. Chase is an account executive at Hiros, which is an ad tracking and AI optimization software for over 3000 global businesses with over 3 billion in ad spend. And they also work with consultants and coaches like Tony Robbins, Clickfunnels, Grant Cardone, and other such as Playboy, actually. So Chase is also the host and co host of sales players, which is a podcast for all the top players in the b two B space. So, Chase, I'll let you take it away. Tell us a little bit more about your professional life at Hiros and your current career as a content creator as well with sales players.

Yeah, thanks guys for hopping on the call and inviting me to the podcast uploading. Really have enjoyed using cast magic. And really, I would take a step back and say that what got me into Hiros was actually, I had my own business and I had gotten into actually running my own ads and I had, I burned a lot of money, um, with ads. And something I didn't realize is having a server side tracking tool and the importance of actually having a tool like this, uh, because you get a lot of ads in your internal feeds from Instagram, YouTube, and everybody makes it seem like it's really simple, uh, but it is a lot more complex. And with a tool like Hiros, I think, uh, it really can help those looking to run ads.

Yeah, and I'll jump into that and say, you know, that's, that's a problem you solve for us. And, you know, I remember when we connected, we were having that issue ourselves and it's, it's really tough to fly blind and most people think, all right, well, I'll just go ahead and set this up myself. But good luck. Try and do that. Especially for founders, it is not the best place to be using your energy, time and resources and. But, yeah, chase, ever since we first connected as a professional, I was very impressed with just who you are as a professional, everything you do in sales, I think there's going to be a lot of key takeaway learnings for our audience. Here you go as far as even giving your phone number. You text with your prospects, with your clients.

Risky move, but I respect it and I love it. Tell us more about how has it been to be at Hiros and, you know, and just going that extra mile, you know, I think the company saw really rapid growth, has been seeing really rapid growth. So we just love to get a high level of Hiros as an organization.

Yeah. And I've been transparency. I've been at Hiros. I was recruited back in September of 2023, and at the end of 2024, I think we were at 24 million AAR. Um, and Alex Becker, we've been around since 2019. And Alex Becker, he's our founder, and he has actually come from the creator space. So he has a YouTube channel, talks a lot about crypto and. But he's really been in the influencer space for a very long time with Russell Bronson of Clickfunnels.

Uh, Jay Shetty is one of our clients. So he had seen issues before the iOS 14 update and the GA four update and these different updates with privacy before anything was happening, because he was running so much with ads. And so really the thing that we saw for is attribution, missed attribution, really understanding where your, uh, leads are coming in from. How are they converting, even if they're like, coming in through organic, then a paid ad, then they might look at a YouTube video, then they might look from somewhere else. But being able to stitch this all together in Hiros, we have a team of about 100 people, all distributed across the entire world. I think we're headquartered in Austin, Texas, but we are a fully remote team, and I'm on the sales floor, so I'm an individual contributor. And one of the interesting things about being at Hiros is with Alex's clout and the cloud of our business, we have just a huge inbound flow. So we just have great inbound demos, so we don't have to do as much outbound.

So we're starting to really pivot and start to look for partners, agencies to help us with our growth and do more of an outbound strategy.

Chase. One thing I'd love to talk about is kind of like Ramon was alluding to some of the bigger creators. As their audience build, as they put together more complex offers, they start to, you know, run ads. But for typical everyday creators, maybe they haven't gotten that far. Could you just kind of paint the picture of what it looks like? Like, what type of offers are, like, bigger creators putting together what, like, why are they even running ads in the first place? And then what do they come to Hyros to do with those ads?

Great question, and I'm actually trying to solve this problem myself with our, with our podcast with sales players. But basically, what a lot of these creators are doing is basically they're running ads to a low ticket offer. So let's say some sort of, could be a $7 course, could be a $27 course. Then when the actual person comes into the funnel, they're going to have a mid ticket offer, then a high ticket offer. And this is really where you really want to start to understand where's your best traffic source coming in and how those leads are actually converting and if they're taking those, if you might have 100 leads that come in that purchase the $27 course, but ten of those actually take the $5,000 upsell, you really want to understand that.

And, you know, the key here as well from Hyros, which is something we struggle, we had, I personally had struggled with in the past, is you think that the platforms are giving you the attribution themselves. So why should I need a platform challenges. A lot of platforms over attribute. They, they're taking credit for sales that aren't necessarily their sales, especially if you're doing retargeting. They're missing attribution. If the conversion happens on mobile instead of, you know, instead of desktop. And, and there's just a lot of, a lot of rotate there. So when it comes to, you know, running ads as a professional or a creator, what are some of the first ways that you should tackle it that you consider? So, like, say, I actually want to test that $7 offer.

What are the first things I should look at to put together that first offer?

Great question. So I would first make sure that you have tracking set up, that you have some sort of CRM, you have some sort of call booking funnel in that it, it's not all over the place. You want to use some sort of CRM that could be go high level, that could be HubSpot, and then basically you. I wouldn't start with every platform. Uh, I would start mainly with either Facebook or Google, and then I would start to understand my funnel and get that one page of, okay, what is my offer? Intro. Offer page. Get that page done, get some basic creative and start running ads to getting people to the page and seeing if they start to opt in. The issue that you were talking about, Ramon, was a lot of times what happens if somebody clicked on your ad and then maybe six months later they purchase? You're not going to know that that person found you through that ad.

And so that's really where you want to start to analyze. Like, how are these people finding you? And what stages the funnel? Are they falling off?

Yeah, one thing, one thing you mentioned there was getting them on a call. And so, but at the same time, you're talking about ad attribution. So I'm sure people's questions in the audience is, Chase, you're talking about ad attribution, but you're telling me to get them on a call. My phone doesn't integrate with, with any of that stuff. Is that trackable through hiros.

So there we do have call tracking. So we do have a native call tracking tool to where we can use dynamic number swaps. But a call for me would be like somebody booking an appointment through, like a calendly. Um, and that's really what I've seen going through thousands accounts through clickfunnels. Um, a lot of these big course creators is they will have just a opt in page, but then if it's a higher ticket item, they're going to have somebody that's going to opt in for a call. Then you're going to have the phone call closer. That's going to either qualify or unqualify that call. And this is another stage where Hiros, we can actually show and tell the actual ad platform.

This was a, you brought us a qualified lead, or you brought us an unqualified lead and being able to feed that back in and show, okay, you're giving us good data or you're giving us bad data.

Yeah. And I think that's one of my favorite features, because otherwise, you don't even know that you can actually, you know, you wouldn't even have the thought that calendly is the way to attribute this. And it's not just a call. It can be a demo of whatever software, whatever platform you have. Demos are now attributable, and you can even have the attribution down to the campaign or ad level. It's not just what platform brought it in. You can really get into the nitty gritty, and I love that about the platform. So, Chase, you were dogfooding your, you know, your guys's own product.

You have a podcast called sales players. And, you know, you're, you're now running the ads. So you're living in the product that you're selling, which I think it's one of the best ways you could possibly sell a product, is why we built Cas magic. It was a product we live in every single day. So tell us about the starting of sales players. How long have you been doing the podcast? Was it daunting as a professional to just start a podcast and what advice you have for professionals that might be listening, that are considering, you know, creating content themselves?

Yeah, it's a great question. So the podcast was actually founded by a guy named Jesse Woodbury. So Jesse's my co host, and he used to call the podcast SaaS sales players, and he's been doing it for probably two and a half years. When I sunsetted my last business, which was lifebar, it was a d two c smoothie bar, my shopify rep told me, she was like, you need to get into SaaS sales. And I was like, well, I don't even know what SaaS sales is. And so I just went into the podcast app and typed in SaaS sales, and Jesse's podcast landed up there at the top. And so I just cold outreached him and we created a relationship, and he helped me to get my first job in SaaS sales. And he had a slack community, and so we just kept in contact.

And he said, you know, hey, you're doing really well at your job. You went from an SDR to an AE. Would you like to co host with me? And so this was back in January, and one of the things that I have really leaned into, and especially if you have for your listeners, is really lean into your LinkedIn. I would say LinkedIn and networking is so important for creating content. It's not about the amount of viewers or followers, especially. You can do these one to one conversations and really niche into your audience and start to help people. And I started to get, I got into Scott leases, Scotty's little sales club. I got into all these little different sales groups because I just wanted to get better at sales.

And what I have found is with the sales players, it's been a great place for me to interview awesome guests and also just scratch my own itch of creating content and helping others.

Yeah, I would, I would love to learn more about that, like your, your workflow of leveraging the podcast for creating content. You know, what, how do you leverage the podcast in and of itself for your LinkedIn or, you know, all of your industry insights and content in general?

So there's two different ways that I'm leveraging the podcast. One of them is to I have used the podcast as a way to get like ICP candidates onto the so I actually have a one to one in conversation with a key player. ICP is like your ideal customer profile. So lets say that im going after a large agency. Instead of me just cold calling them, I could be like, hey, would you like to be on the podcast? And thats been a great way for me to create a relationship with the ICP. Another way is ive been using Urals product Cas magic to actually pull the transcripts of the actual episodes and to help create email flows within Convertkit and then also just create. We're actually working on a course that we're going to be pulling just from all the different podcast episodes that we're doing to help people that might be out of a job or they're looking to make, to get into tech. So we have so much content that it would just be, it would take hours to understand what's actually going on and we can just dump it into cast magic and it can help to spit out some awesome tactical steps for people.

Chase one thing that you mentioned that I want to go a little bit further into is you said that for Hyros, you guys have almost moved from a traditional outbound motion to an inbound motion, where now, you know, you have leads coming in, you're qualifying them, you're figuring out who's who, and you're able to, you know, sign up. So your role as an AE is less about like, you know, cold calling a bunch of people being like, hey, sign up for my product. You need it to being like, oh, we have all this inbound content, like, or all this inbound traffic. How do we sort of qualify and figure out, you know, who's the best fit for the tool? I'm curious as to, you know, have you seen being a content creator yourself, having the sales podcast, putting out content? Have you seen leads start to like, come in through the content that you're putting out as well? Do you see LinkedIn as like a viable tool? Is this something that people who are trying to grow business in sales, should they be putting out content as a way to drive awareness and leads?

Yes, I think that, uh, in today's world, uh, especially in SaaS, in, in really anything, your brand, your personal brand is everything. And I think that my personal brand I will attribute me, uh, getting to work at Hiros is because I was posting on LinkedIn consistently, um, and just being in front of those right people. Uh, but that's just me. I wasn't looking to get a job there. I was just consistently posting. But LinkedIn is great for leads. Um, and it really. I think it.

I think you're more likely to, if I like and comment on your post and then maybe I connection request you and then land in your DM's and say, hey, would you like to have a 15 minutes conversation? You're more likely to have somebody accept my connection request and take a meeting with me then I don't. If I wasn't posting.

Yeah, 100%. I think it's. And what's one thing that's always so fascinating about sales? It's like I get a whole bunch of cold emails every single day and I, like, almost don't even. I just, like, discard them. Right? But then I may see one piece of content on LinkedIn where I'm like, oh, shit. Like, whatever this guy said, I really resonate with that. And now I'm trying to hit up this guy who's a sales guy who runs my business in the first place. So I just think the dynamics and the way people think, it's so funny.

It's like if something's sent to you, you're almost like, stop trying to convince me, like, I don't want it. But when you see it out there, you grab the bait and you go after it. So that's why I just. I see sales kind of moving to this, this, you know, increasingly inbound sort of motion. But in order to do that, content's a big driver of it. Um, the next thing I wanted to talk about is the sales specific use case. I'm not sure you've had the chance yet to do anything like this with cast magic, but, um, you know, do you see a world in which, uh, you know, you're able to use a tool like cast magic in actual sales dialogues? Like, I myself, um, having done sales in the past, like, I'd used to pipe sales calls through there and I would, like, queue up all the different things I'd wanted to extract. So, like, who's the customer name? What's their buying intent? Did they mention any other businesses? Do you see tools like this working and supporting sales workflows in the future or.

Currently?

Totally. I see. And I have not had my. The ability to put calls into cast magic from Hiros, but I have. We use Fireflies note taker. And I would say that that really has helped me up my game from just understanding what's actually going on in calls. And then Gong is just huge and I've never used Gong, but I know for like teams it's really beneficial. And I think that one thing, it's, it's great to be able to extract this data and it's going to help sales leaders be able to train people and really understand what's actually happening in these phone, these calls to be able to give actionable next steps, but also be able to train new people on maybe what's our best practice? How could we have changed what I said in that sentence there? And you're actually able to really have better instead of just watching calls.

It's actionable. There's actionable steps put in there.

Yeah. And I think from a content standpoint, conversations with prospects can also lead to content insights. Right. You're noticing as the market changes, you're noticing different objections. And so you have to change how you position things based on market, whether competitors arise, whether just macro conditions are changing. And then sometimes you just answer something spontaneously differently and you're like, man, I wish I had captured that. And you turn that thought or conversation into actual content. Chase, I'd love to switch topics into content creators themselves.

Doing the sales, what advice do you have? Because I might be hearing this as a content creator, I study Alex. Now, I know I can leverage this platform, but I've never done sales. How do I even approach my first sales conversations as a content creator? How do I get over that imposter syndrome of is my content even good enough for me to sell a course or a coaching? What advice do you have for content creators when it comes to sales?

It's a great question and I think it's a great exercise. If you're not already like selling a course or you're an affiliate marketer or you have some sort of offer, is testing your audience if they're going to buy something from you and just create a course, you can go on school like Alex Hermosis deal. Just create a course there. Somebody that I've been following recently is Dan Coe, and I've actually read his book and he has like a whole course. And it's very interesting is you start to see that there is a cut and dry, cut and dry or cut and paste sort of formula that these creators have and you don't want, you don't need to reinvent the wheel. And it's like, go after somebody. There's somebody in your niche that you can emulate. And it doesn't have to be exactly what they're doing, but you can create what they're, you can watch their flow and just, you know, sketch it.

Yeah. And the content itself can be a vehicle to another thing or another product. Like, you know, Alex Becker, you look at his content, he has a very clear formula and hyrules. The content was the vehicle, but Hyros was the actual business behind it. And he used YouTube to just completely blow it up and scale it up. Of course, he built the community over years. I remember he had communities around, you know, selling ads and he had communities around selling courses and things like that. And so it's, it's a grind as well, but it's something that, you know, takes time over time and then it happens.

All of a sudden. It's, it's, it happened with us with DTCP 300 episodes later, the reward was building cast magic as a vehicle. So what resources do you suggest to people who might be wanting to dip their toes? You mentioned you joined these groups. What resources should people look into?

Yes. So to piggyback on what you just said, ramon, I would suggest like the most important thing you can get from your prospect is their email. So any way that you can capture an email, if you're not already capturing your clients emails, start doing that. And that can be even through calendly, which is just a free app. So when you book a meeting with you, all those emails are getting stored in calendly. But then you got to just be thinking, how am I going to distribute a newsletter or put them into a course or create a Facebook community? So you really can go broad on this and it can make you go crazy because everybody says they're a course creator. But I really think you just need to get out there and start to look at really creative, like course creators that you resonate with and start to just go through somebody's course that you might already be looking at and just follow their funnel.

Yeah. And the beauty of getting those emails as early as possible is retargeting. You never know what you might launch later and you're like, damn, I wish I would have collected those 10,000 visitors, pixel them, or have collected their emails. So, Chase, this was a really fun conversation. I'd love for you to also share with the audience that wants to learn about sales, more about sales players, the podcast. And then where can people find you and learn more about you and all things hyros? Yeah.

So you can find me@thesalesplayers.com. Our podcast is a sales players. You can find it on any of the podcast platforms. We're and, and you're, you'll start to see some audio. Grams, Blaine was talking to me about audiograms yesterday. I'm really excited about posting those. And then with Hyros, uh, you'll be able to find a link specifically for the cast magic team that we're going to give you, um, for a special offer for your guest. But I'm happy to talk to anybody about ads and, um, happy to be a resource.

And you can find me on LinkedIn.

Awesome. Thank you, Chase. Thanks, Chase.

Thank you.