#340 - AI Meets Skincare: Dermalogica’s Formula for Global Success
BB
Speaker
Blaine Bolus
AL
Speaker
Aurelian Lis
Chapters
In this recording
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I'd say at that time it was quite different because you'd have to build everything and there was a huge amount of innovation in a short amount of time where, you know, sort of just permanent people.
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Aurelian Lis
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So when you have so many complex, different channels that you're working in, I think, you know, it's very important that you have a strategy which caters to that because all these businesses are very different. Their business model is different.
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Aurelian Lis
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It's super intuitive, powerful and customizable. Plus the whole thing is powered by AI, so your teams can spend less time on tedious, time consuming stuff and more time on developing relationships.
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Visit HubSpot.com sales to start selling with sales hub what is going on? DTC pod today we are joined by Aurelian Lease, who is the CEO at Dermalogica, which is one of the larger skincare brands globally. So, Aurelian, I'll let you kick us off. Why don't you tell us a little bit about your own personal background, maybe your background before you even got involved with Dermalogica, and then we can kind of get into the company.
Aurelian Lis
Sure. Well, thanks for having me on this podcast. I'm very privileged. I mean, you should. You can guess by my accent that time, maybe from abroad. I was born in the UK and it's always very dangerous to ask somebody who's been in many places to explain where they are because it could take a long, long time. But english, german states for 25 years. My background itself I do run.
I'm the CEO of Dermalogica, which is this wonderful global skincare brand, which is rooted in skin treatment expertise. Probably get to that. We teach a lot of treatments, but I've been in the industry for many, many years. But I'm actually a physicist by training, so I studied atomic physics and laser optics, which is extraordinarily relevant nowadays. And, you know, so that was it. And I worked as an engineer for a few years, so I tend to have more of an analytical, nerdy bent to when I.
When I do things and how I look at the world.
Blaine Bolus
Absolutely. And how did you get involved? What was your path to getting involved as the global CEO of Dermalogica? What were you, you know, what was your career beforehand? Did you have any roles in the commerce space or the consumer space or what did that look like?
Aurelian Lis
Yeah, I mean, so I, you know, I started. I started in some sort of a number of finance jobs quite quickly went into sales and marketing in the cosmetics industry with some of the prestige, some of the beautiful brands like Elizabeth Arden in the heyday and Calvin Klein and those. I later actually moved to the states because of a DTC opportunity, you know, when it was the first 1st big Internet wave.
So I was part of a company called Delia's, which is teenage girls clothing company. And we took. It was a catalog business. We took it public April. It was April 9, 99.
3:41
Built an early DCC, later entered skincare industry.
So 25 years ago, about just a few months ago, and it was quite a big valuation, raised quite a lot of money, and then went set about building one of the first DCC companies. It was called iturf enlisted on Nasdaq. I'd say at that time it was quite different because you'd have to build everything and there was a huge amount of innovation in a short amount of time where, you know, sort of just permanent people.
I remember being excited about, we can have a permanent shopping basket, you know, and that was, it was, that was where that industry was there. So I was there for quite a few years. We sold the pieces off to other companies, and then I moved on back into the skincare industry, had my own business for ten years, and then also a stint in running a large part of a makeup company. And, you know, that really brought me to Logica, wherever.
I've been here for a good part of eight years, actually.
So it's a good run. And we've expanded a lot, including in DTC and e commerce, which has been really important for us.
Blaine Bolus
And I'm super excited. I want to get all the way into Dermalogica. But my question was going to be, you said you took the company public, your first company. What was that experience? How old were you? What were some of the learnings, looking back, that you carried forward with yourself as a CEO?
Aurelian Lis
Yeah, so I was part of the company. I was a 24 year old. I was part of a company being okay.
Blaine Bolus
Okay.
Aurelian Lis
And there were 20. There were 20. I think we were about 25 people. And the average age of the company, everybody was 26. So it was founded by Steve Khan, who, and he was a graduate student, so we'd known him. I'd known him for quite a few years when I had met him. And it was just very good at understanding that there's this new opportunity and especially the way it would change the catalog business, particularly.
And that was quite an exciting part of it.
We did. When we went public, we only had $2 million in revenue by the time. Within a year or something, we had $60 million of revenue. That's quite a. At that point, that was quite substantial. We got to do our AOL deals like everybody else, buying keywords for insane amounts of money. So all these sort of things were happening at that time.
Blaine Bolus
Perfect. And talk to me about now. You transition. Do you come on to Dermalogic as the CEO, or what does your entry point look like? What does the company look like if you could just characterize it as you come on as CEO?
Aurelian Lis
Dermalogica is this beautiful brand. It was in one family, the founders hands, for 35 years and grown up, think about. And it was still fully owned by them until just before I came, when there was an acquisition by a larger media or a larger group called Unilever acquired it. So unilever then brought me in. The essence of the brand, which is so interesting, is that it teaches skin treatments. That's what I got. So literally, you can think of us as like a university where we teach therapists how to do better skin treatments.
And even today, we still do a hundred.
We teach 100,000 therapists a year. So in the states, for example, I got 15 different teaching facilities and this. So when we think about, you know, technology, when we think about a lot of things about the way of doing business, it's often built around that skin treatment expertise and that skill development, the skill development. So for the therapists who come to us, where we basically promise them, hey, if you can do, we'll teach you something that will be good and you'll be able to take care of your own life.
You will have, you know, you'll be in charge, so to speak. And in the same way, we think about people and, and our employees where we always want to, we're very much about skill development. I came in. I came.
So it was quite, you know, so it was. And then sort of the first CEO after the founders always has a job to do, right. Big steps. Beautiful steps to Phil, I'm very lucky that the founders and Jane Whirlwind is still actively involved in the company. So she helps me with some strategy, sometimes product innovation and such. But we've got wonderful, solid team and then we, that's how we sort of develop and move forward.
8:08
Founder transitions to CEO unlocks business growth.
Blaine Bolus
And I think what you just mentioned, that's always such an interesting point for a founder, because a lot of times maybe the founder who starts the business is inspired to start a business and take it to a certain amount of revenue, a certain amount of scale. Maybe they are great at that and maybe they can unlock the next phase of growth with the business by bringing in the right CEO. So, as you said when you came in, what were some of the objectives?
You said the brand had just been acquired by Unilever. Youve got all these networks of, you know, treatments and, and skincare therapists that are being able to, you know, educate the consumers and provide the treatment. So what did it look like? What were some of the first challenges and what were some of the goals bringing you on as a CEO? Like, what were you there to do to unlock for the brand?
Aurelian Lis
Well, I think, you know, the, the brand was a set, a beautiful brand, great reputation. There's a lot to work with as well, which was really important for me. You know, there's fly by night brands out there. You know, maybe they're okay, maybe not. They are, but then they're brands which have got real heritage where they've been taking care of the consumer for so long and then continually being careful that that relationship has meant been maintained.
That's what dermalogic was like. It wasn't, on the other hand, growing as much as it needed to. It was basically, you know, sort of stay sort of flat, which was, it's okay.
But growth is healthy for a company, especially in a changing, rapidly changing environment. I believe, like, if you're growing, it shows that, you know, that you're, you're winning new battles. And when you're winning new battles, it means you're doing the right thing. Right. So it's important for that. And so, yeah, we've injected a lot of growth. We've more than doubled the business then, since then. And, you know, and originally the international footprint was very large as well.
We still have an very large international footprint. So it was more about changing the way we work within markets than just sort of coming to a new territory and adding it. Although China is one of the places where we did add a bit of business, most of the other places, I would say, would be is more changing. And within that it's also thinking about your channels, which ones you're in. Demologic, I'd say is a business that operates in a lot of distribution channels.
And I mean, there is like, we have, our biggest part of the business is salons. It's salons and Medispas. It's sort of a place where you can get Botox or the place where you can get a facial skin treatment.
10:41
They distribute products through retail and direct channels.
Those people use our products in the back bar and then also give those products to the consumer to take home. Then we've got a big part in retail and then the US, that would mean Alta, it would mean Sephora, for example, in the rest of the world. I mean, Selfridges in the UK or Mecca in Australia. So we in very many retailers and we have a DTC, our own DTC, where we run our own web stores.
And then we also run our marketplace stores like for example, on Amazon Marketplace. And as though that's not enough in a number of countries, we've also got flagships. So when you have so many complex, different channels that you're working in, I think, you know, it's very important that you have a strategy which caters to that because all these businesses are very different. Their business model is different.
What makes them successful is different. You know, you've done, what is it, 350 interviews that basically people on DTC, right, there's a rich knowledge of people. The idea that somebody in a retailer or just a brand can turn up one day and say, now from tomorrow on, I'm going to be a DTC brand. It's just not true. You have to have that specialized knowledge. And so we structure ourselves in a decentralized way so that it spans those different channels and that we try and cater to our consumers and to our clients, the retailers and our partners as best we can.
Blaine Bolus
So, Aurelian, one thing that you just mentioned, which is so right, you've got all these different channels. And today the talk of, you know, everyone's talking about omnichannel, right? And what that means. And that means for from a D two c sense, it means being on Amazon, you know, selling direct and then maybe, you know, selling in a couple different retailers. That's like the general idea of, you know, generalized omnichannel today.
But what you just mentioned, you guys have your own brick and mortar. You work with, um, you know, different places like Sephora and ulta on the treatment side. So you've got people with your product in hand distributing it that way. Um, you've got all these different businesses.
And when you came on, what did you, you said you came on to unlock growth. So what were some of the biggest growth levers that you pulled? Was it, you know, was it saying, the first couple of years, let's focus on our distribution network of therapists, let's focus on our, you know, commerce arm. Like when you came in and you saw the opportunity and you said, okay, my responsibility is to start growing this thing, where did you see the biggest opportunity to unlock some of that growth that you guys have experienced?
Aurelian Lis
I think you unlock real opportunity mostly when you think about how you go about your problem rather than just thinking about that sort of one single initiative, which just makes the difference, although those initiatives do definitely come. And so we defined a different way of working to a certain extent. The first thing is, as I said, the complexity. You want to delegate authority properly. You delegate it with guardrails so people know.
So you basically stretch them as much as you can. And when you delegate authority, it means that you look at your different needs, like, for example, your DTC, and make sure that there's somebody who lives, breathes it and has to do it. The second point is an innovation from a company.
We have beautiful innovation. We just launched Bioluminescea Night Risk store, which is sort of a fabulous addition in our biolimacy vitamin C franchise. And we've got so many good examples of great products that sets a bit of a pace for the entire company. But innovation can't just be product, right? That would be sad, because what about all the people in all the other departments who at the party at the end of the year sort of have to sort of like, oh, we had a great year because we had some nice product innovation, but they had nothing to do with it.
Now, I want innovation in every function. I want, you know, the finance function to be using our robotic processes. I want the DTC function to say, you know what, we've done something really cool. And maybe four years ago it was opening up a VR store.
Maybe that was it, maybe a year before that, it was about changing the way that we actually moved off tomware, which later became Salesforce commerce cloud. And we were one of the earlier people who moved over to Shopify. That was innovation for them and the way we use the ecosystem. So it's these ways of working, I think, that does a difference. So you tell people what they're in charge of, you push them to do innovation.
You don't make them, you make them not afraid of switching stuff off. You try to make sure that people aren't afraid of failing. You try and compare yourself or basically using data, decide what the decisions are you should be making.
You make sure all that is within the brand. So it's more like, so then these different teams go off into their own right and they have the different successes. The Sephora team king bit later, later became possible. And they do some amazing things in Sephora. We work with micro needling pension in Sephora when we do customer events and we touching 120 people in a couple of days. And it's amazing things that that team decided make sense for the brand and, you know, sort of with the push that we give them from the center.
So that's sort of the way we think about it. It's a, it's like a multi pronged approach, making sure you're good where you are.
Blaine Bolus
No, that makes a bunch of sense. And I'm curious because like you said, you, you rely so heavily on all these different teams and functions to work cohesively towards the goal and the direction that you guys set. But just talk to me in terms of, like, scale. In terms of the, like, you know, roughly like how big are you guys in terms of, um, you know, headcount. If you could just characterize like how, you know, you guys structure things from a people's perspective.
16:44
Global company with 5000 people and 18 subsidiaries.
Aurelian Lis
Yeah, we're pretty big. I mean, we're 1500 people globally at the moment, right? We're about ten different subsidiaries. So in major markets we have our own operations like the US, Canada, Australia, the UK and all these sort of other ones. Then we as, on a global basis, we also work with distributors. So then if you can, you would include those people in there, probably about 5000 people dedicated to dermalogica.
And we have a very flat organization. I have 18 direct reports, which basically means out of which there's 18 mini organizations underneath me, which is, you know, is a good way to keep it flat, to let people make the decisions and then have, you know, there's a few things where we have quite strong guardrails where I'd say only this you can do because only this is domologica. But most of those are things I inherited, not really me.
It was like it was the founders who decided what the essence of the company would be. And those are the ones I don't want to change. You know, we're about skin treatment expertise and that is what it is. And it's great and it's beautiful and it resonates and works everything else. You know, you can show. How do you bring it to life and those sort of things you can move. And so that's essentially the way we work, really, in every area from DTC to professional.
Blaine Bolus
And one thing you had mentioned when we were chatting was how you guys are really all about innovation when it comes to the technology, the product, the processes, and even now, integrating things like AI and different like things like that into your workflow. So why don't you just talk to us about, you know, innovation, how you guys are approaching it, what you guys are thinking, how you guys are even putting AI to work in, you know, a company like yourself?
Aurelian Lis
I think, yeah. The really interesting thing for me with AI, we'll start with, we've been using machine learning for quite a while, for example, for testing on our website.
And sometimes it's integrated in its own tools, sometimes it might. But there's a tool like intellimize which helps personalization, and this continuous conversion test that we do online. So we've been doing that for a while now. Genai is a bit different. Genai is not. If this than that, it's more probabilistic.
It's really quite cool, rather than just saying, look, I want one clever idea. And that clever idea, the entire, we'll be using that sort of philosophy that we had, which was innovation deserves to be in every part. We upskilled people, we upskilled our employees in, we did some seminars. We sort of showed when chat GPT was starting out what it can do. Then we created some pioneers to give use cases, and we did a hackathon and we brought a couple of professors in to actually explain how the vector codes.
And it all works. That one I enjoyed, but, yeah, I'm not sure that most of the audience did, so maybe, which is okay as well. And we keep pushing it.
So now I see in all these different disciplines, I see them embracing Genai. I mean, it's a marketing function, uses it in concept development. We use it for rapidly making real time meetings, making meetings more real time, for example, by being able to check names for new products virtually instantaneously. And that was all, you know, that's built through custom GPTs and stuff. So. But these are what's even more exciting than what the actual things that we're doing is that so many of those ideas were created by the team.
They knew what they wanted to achieve, and they went out, we give them the permission to do it and they do it. So it's, you know, it's marketing assets, it's translations, you know, which is easy as well.
20:28
Advancing translation and digital face mapping technology.
And you're trying to. We're now working on batch processing of translations and also into interesting dialects, which interesting as well. So it's not just French, but it's Quebecois French or it's, you know, not just English, but Australian English, you know, so that nobody has to touch it again. And then of course there's a very big field where we have been pushing for a long time is what we call face mapping. And that face mapping is based on facial skin analysis.
And that's really as well inherent to the brand because a therapist's have always looked at people's skin at the beginning of a therapy. Basically you're double cleansed. And they look at then the therapist touches you, feels your skin and says what exactly? What do I see? What do I like? What you as a kind of why is there anything that bothers you? And then that discussion sort of leads to what's the right thing?
What's the right personalized solution? At this point we have a digital version of doing it for consumers, which more than two and a half million consumers have taken face maps.
And then we see them. When we track those consumers, we can see that they're more twice likely to complete purchases and they have higher aovs, a lot of them are new. And it's really the education that we can give them about what we're seeing that's so exciting for them. Now that sort of technology has evolved this cycle on its 8th generation, but the last generations have started to use more Genai in them.
The early generations were more algorithm based because the dirty secret about all these facial analysis tools is there's some beautiful technology which tells you the computer what it's seeing. So the computer can work out whether it's an acne spot or age spot, for example, right? But then the link between that to what products are suggested is like just a really dumb algorithm. It's like an Excel spreadsheet that your grandmother wrote for you, right?
And so that's the way it was in the industry. And so, you know, it's like having a million dollars of equipment to be able to through a photo decide that somebody's got acne.
And then basically all you're doing is telling them, go to the section called acne and you have to ask what the quality and what the purpose of that for consumer was. Because they sort of knew they had acne. Most people do, right? So now it's much better. It's sort of like we look, we see, and with the probabilistic nature of Genai and the new LLMs, we can actually sort of do much better sort of what it is exactly that you want.
And we could need a, and there's a lot more inputs that can come into it, and it's a hell of a lot more exciting.
23:21
DTC Pod joins HubSpot's network, enhancing personalized experiences.
Blaine Bolus
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podcastNetwork well, I think that is super exciting because, like you're saying, you know, what you're essentially doing is you have customer data that they're able to feed you that's unique to that customer and you're able to give them a personalized experience, and AI just unlocks so much, and that would be such a difficult experience to build. Before, like you were saying, you have, you know, the, the previous state, which is like a simple lifecycle marketing flow where if someone goes down this user journey, we send them this product.
Whereas now with the customer data plus the LLMs plus the technology that you guys have, you can really start to scale that personalized treatment, which is effectively what you guys have. And this is the next topic I want to really dig in on island. Um, you know, you were saying how so much of the success of your business comes, or one of the, you know, key drivers of the business is the fact that you've got these educators who are therapists in, uh, you know, who you're able to educate, and then they can educate the customers and give them the real thing.
Blaine Bolus
That's something that a real human is doing and a real professional human is doing. So it's almost like now, through, you know, AI, you're able to bring that personalization to scale, um, which is super exciting. But I do want to go back and talk about this because this is so exciting just from a, you know, from a distribution point of view, but also from a, like you were saying, it's its own business to run.
So I'd love to kind of dig in deeper on what it takes to maintain a network of therapists who are up to date on, you know, what your products are, what they do, and, and everything like that, because they become an extension of your brand. Right. Like this is the, a lot of times probably one of the first, most important touch points for a new consumer who becomes part of the dermalogica ecosystem.
25:31
Skincare therapist alumni maintain relationships through technology.
Aurelian Lis
Yes, I mean, it's very true. I mean, we refer to the therapists who you describe in that way, the professional skincare therapist as the tribe. And it's interesting that the tribe, when you think about what makes somebody a member of the tribe, it's basically that they came to our school, they had peers, they had a teacher, and they graduated. And so now they're alumni and that's really the step that goes in.
And then they've know us for years and they, you know, even when they move through jobs, they still have this relationship to the, you know, where you're an alumna of. So it's a, it's very much that now. The way that we now see it is, you know, technology is there to enhance, it's not to replace. And I think, yeah, you know, so as we think about scale, it's how can I easily get them a tool to look up the, you know, the data that they want to do as easily as possible?
So one of the first, you know, within, I think when there's been, you know, when was it? In November 2 years ago that sort of Chad GPT started all this stuff.
I think it was within like two months, three months that we launched the first chatbot, so to speak, with the, which built on our resources, our own proprietary data. So to help a therapist find out, you know, what product was or how to use a product. For example, if it's like using a procedure that was actually the first thing we did was for therapists, and we built that very quickly. Right. So it's about the tools. And I think going forward this element of human touch is going to continue.
And, you know, it's very interesting for me as well as, you know, sort of sticking with the topics you're talking about. But as we think of where the future is going, so many people talk about personalization, but how do you get personalization to be real? How do you get it to be meaningful? What we believe is very much is that the element of human touch is the way that you acknowledge consumer acknowledges a customer acknowledges that the personalization is relevant because you have acknowledged them as a person.
So a good example of exactly what it's not is the personalization, which means that on the Amazon website, on the top right hand corner, it says, hello, Aurelian. That is, you know, maybe it is personalization in somebody's book, but it's not what we mean. Right. There's no emotional connection. Right. So that's really an interesting thing for me, is for a brand that at its heart is physical connections, not just, you know, when we talk about human touch, it's not just connection, it's really somebody's touching your face and we make people touch somebody else's face.
Right. That's a very, very personal thing.
How does a brand like that continue to differentiate itself? By not just being the name in the top right hand corner. And that's one of, you know, that's sort of one of the big things that that's why I'm excited about trying to use technology.
And it's not as obvious as just somebody might make you think, no.
Blaine Bolus
And I think that's such an important point because like you were saying, your role is essentially leading the direction. And sometimes you need to have that. You really need to understand what not only the mission of the company is, but sometimes it's a little bit more abstracted than just like you're saying, oh, let's launch initiative, do XYZ. You've got a cohesive vision in saying, hey, wait a minute, we are a brand that is super personal with the customer.
So how does that present itself in terms of the technology, in terms of the product, in terms of our therapists who are doing the treatment, in terms of our digital storefront, in terms of our retail presence. So I think that's a really important nugget for that's exactly the way we continue.
Aurelian Lis
We think about it. So, for example, for, for a brand that's rooted in teaching skin treatments, it's obvious that when I'm working in a professional skincare therapist, it's about the skin treatment that's doing. But if we're in retail when they don't do skin treatments, we still have to be true to ourselves. We can't be somebody else just because we're there. It means that we have to bring skin treatments to life in the events we do, in the way we speak to consumers, in the way we teach the staff who work there.
We teach them in a totally different way than all the other brands. We teach them the way we would teach somebody who's going to do a skin treatment at their clinic. And so it's being true to who you are, but definitely realizing that in each area you need to do it in a different way.
Because for one thing, if not others, you don't have beds. In retail, we have put one or two. We managed to do one once in the center of Sephora for the, for a launch, which was quite fun in Yorkdale in Canada. And it was shocking to everybody. Like, why is there a treatment bed in the middle of our shop? But, but generally there aren't beds. You know, there aren't beds where you have a Sephora.
Blaine Bolus
Aurelian. One of my last questions was going to be, as we wrap up here, you've been CEO at Dermalogica now for, you know, are we coming up on nine years or something like that? Yeah, something like that. What have your biggest learning, your personal learnings been in terms of leading the companies? Like, what are looking back over those nine years? Like, what are some of the biggest learnings that you've seen and growth that you've seen as a person?
31:01
Continuous improvement and innovation drive business waves.
Aurelian Lis
Look, I think. I think you never just, you just can never stay still and sort of, you don't rest on your laurels and you, you sort of try and create this, this momentum and this tribe where people are always trying to improve and do things in new ways. I think business comes in waves when you look at it, and I think about that sometimes in some parts of the business, it's very obvious that there's a wave.
But whether it's. If I think about e commerce, it started the first generation of ecommerce websites, maybe a bit later than the one I was talking about in 99, 2000, but, you know, just pretty. They were run by creative guy who would say, like, you know, creative agency. So, no, I know exactly the shade. And I want the whole thing just to be dark or light, you know, and that mood.
And then the Instagram came in and we had to change the way of that. People were finding out about us. We went to paid media. It was a fundamental shift on, you know, sort of suddenly learning to. How to win through PMax and ESC rather than others. And these sort of things keep going like TikTok at the moment, especially if you're working with Douyin in China, the live selling that we're doing now is just totally different.
And the way we're trying to build it and we're building communities now as well. So it's these waves that come over, and I think you need to be ready to harness them, not afraid of the change.
And hopefully you have people who thrive on the. They thrive on the change. It makes it exciting, right? It's like, we do what we did, but we continually look for ways to do it, to think, is this the best way? How do I tweak it, how do I improve it and move forward?
Blaine Bolus
I think that's what really stands out to me, at least in talking to you about how you think about building the company. You really have this ethos of innovation that comes from the top down. And I think a lot of larger companies, maybe they don't have that, maybe they're a slightly more risk averse. But the fact that you're so versatile in all the newest platforms and saying, let's embrace those, because we've seen this playbook over and over again.
There's shifts in the way consumers find, buy, approach and buy products. And we want to be ready for everything, whether it's how we implement AI into our processes or the ultimate end channels, that the consumer is going to find us being ready. I think that's something that definitely stands out versus other companies, which is very exciting. My last question for you was going to be advice you may have for other operators or founders running a brand.
I think a lot of people want to aspire to, um, you know, built a global brand in the way that you have a lot start with a niche product and then start to, like, scale up and scale up. So do you have any advice for, you know, founders or operators who are looking to, you know, unlock that next wave of growth for their brands?
Aurelian Lis
Look, I think, you know, every brand has to decide, you know, I think you have to decide what organizational structure is the right one for you. And that is one of the most important things I think you can decide, you know, and so small brands will know this. You know, there's a question I remember when I had my own brand, so many, so many days I start, I would think about, is this something I should be doing in house or should I outsource it?
Right? Because there's a limited, there's limited resources, but also limited time. And so you're making that question. The good thing about the entrepreneurs founders I've always loved is that they found their way through the maze and they went down a dead end. It wasn't the right one. They turn around and come back and if they didn't do that, they're not founders anymore because it didn't work out. And they have that with time.
34:43
Companies must balance structure and founder-like innovation.
A lot of companies start cementing things in place because they want scale, because they want to synergize and stuff. And for certain brands, that can be fine, because the way the brand is, what's being sort of glued in a bit like in the Lego film is okay. But for others, especially if you want to be at the frontier of something like DTC, you probably need to think very carefully about how do you make sure that you've still got that person who's the equivalent of a founder in the different areas of your company, leading, you know, finding the maze, going down the wrong areas, realizing
it's the wrong one, doing the U turn and moving down the right. You need to sort of let those people be in your organization and follow them, because otherwise, you know, you're going to be. The story. There was a big, just one last example is, you know, one of the biggest, one of our biggest competitors just put out lots of stories of why, or the fact that they just went to something called Amazon prime.
You know, prime beauty and a three p. It's a marketplace with some premium effects.
35:56
Why did they wait five years?
And it was great to see that they did it. But the interesting thing was not why they did it in 2024, but why didn't they do it in 2018 when we did it? Why, why are they five years late? I mean, that is an interesting thing for me, right? Is how. How do you really sort of realize that you're at the top, you're moving when you need to move, and you haven't glued yourself to the floor so that you're five years late?
Blaine Bolus
I love that. Aurelian, thank you so much for joining us. We learned a ton. Congrats to you guys and all the success. And for our listeners who want to learn more about the brand, where can we find you guys? Maybe if you shout out your socials or where we can just connect with you and the brand in general.
Aurelian Lis
Dermalogica. Hash. Dermalogica and hash. Some people like to love to pronounce it dermatologica, but we do joke in the company that the t is silent. So it's just dermalogica. Dermalogica.com is a wonderful place. We're also with big retailers like Alta and Sephora. We're on Amazon.
We should be. And of course, like, what I love about going to the dermalogica.com site is there you can also find the therapist who can give you the most amazing facial skin treatment, be it on the Medispa end of the spectrum or more the traditional, but always with advanced results. So that's. That's the place I would go.
Blaine Bolus
I love it. Thanks so much for coming on Aurelion. We loved it.
Aurelian Lis
Thank you very much. Take care.
Blaine Bolus
Support. A rating and review would go a long way as we continue to host the best builders in DTC and beyond. Follow and subscribe to the show and make sure to check out our show notes, where you can find our socials and weekly newsletter. Visit us on dtcpod.com to join our founder community and access resources from every episode. We'll see you on the next pod.
Also generated
More from this recording
1️⃣ One Sentence Summary
Dermalogica CEO shares strategies for growth, innovation, and brand consistency.
🔑 7 Key Themes
Slack community launch for D2C founders
HubSpot Sales Hub promotion and features
Aurelian Lis's background and career journey
Dermalogica's focus on skin therapist education
AI and technology in personalized experiences
Maintaining brand authenticity across diverse channels
Embracing innovation and adaptability for growth
💬 Keywords
Here are 30 topical keywords covered in the text, separated by commas:
In this episode, Blaine Bolus sits down with Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, to discuss his journey from atomic physics to leading a global skincare brand. Lis shares valuable insights on fostering innovation, adapting to change, and maintaining brand consistency across diverse channels.
Today, they cover:
Lis's unique background and path to becoming CEO of Dermalogica
How Dermalogica leverages AI and technology to enhance personalized experiences
The importance of maintaining a strong brand identity across various platforms
Cultivating a culture of continuous innovation and adaptability from the top down
Advice for founders and operators on embracing change for growth
DTC Pod Linkedin
@Aurelian Lis, CEO of @Dermalogica, joins host @Blaine Bolus on the latest episode of DTC Pod to discuss the brand's evolution and growth strategies since its acquisition by @Unilever. Aurelian shares insights on navigating diverse distribution channels, fostering a culture of innovation, and leveraging AI and personalization to enhance customer experiences. We explore the importance of adaptive leadership, maintaining brand consistency across platforms, and the role of Dermalogica's professional skin therapist network in driving consumer engagement. Tune in for valuable lessons on embracing change, scaling operations, and staying ahead in the ever-evolving beauty industry. Full episode here: [Spotify Link] #dtcpod #beautyindustry #ecommerce #innovation #AIinbeauty #personalization #brandconsistency #leadershiplessons
03:41 Built an early DCC, later entered skincare industry.
08:08 Founder transitions to CEO unlocks business growth.
10:41 They distribute products through retail and direct channels.
16:44 Global company with 5000 people and 18 subsidiaries.
20:28 Advancing translation and digital face mapping technology.
23:21 DTC Pod joins HubSpot's network, enhancing personalized experiences.
25:31 Skincare therapist alumni maintain relationships through technology.
31:01 Continuous improvement and innovation drive business waves.
34:43 Companies must balance structure and founder-like innovation.
35:56 Why did they wait five years?
❇️ Key topics and bullets
Here is a comprehensive sequence of topics covered in the text, with sub-topics listed under each main topic:
Introduction
Slack Community Launch for D2C pod
HubSpot Sales Hub Promotion
Guest Introduction: Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica
Aurelian Lis's Background
Early life and education
Professional experience in finance, sales, and marketing
Experience with Delia's and taking the company public
Dermalogica Overview
Acquisition by Unilever
Focus on teaching skin treatments and educating therapists
Company size and structure
Innovation and Technology at Dermalogica
Emphasis on innovation in technology, products, and processes
Use of AI and machine learning for website testing and personalization
GenAI implementation for various operations and employee upskilling
AI Implementation in Dermalogica
AI in marketing, real-time meetings, product naming, and translations
Face mapping technology for personalized skin treatments
Customer-focused technology for enhanced consumer experience
Dermalogica's Training and Educator Network
Maintaining a network of trained therapists
Therapists as crucial touchpoints for new consumers
AI integration to scale personalized experiences and support therapists
Key Strategies and Principles
Alumni as a community or "tribe"
Integration of technology to enhance human interaction
Emphasis on real personalization through meaningful human interactions
Consistency across channels in embodying brand essence
Innovative adaptation in retail spaces
Advice for Founders and Operators
Continuous innovation and adaptability
Embracing change for growth
Maintaining consistent brand identity across platforms and experiences
Adopting new technologies and platforms for relevance and engagement
Organizational Structure and Leadership
Decision-making on in-house tasks vs. outsourcing for small brands
Importance of adaptive leadership and retaining an entrepreneurial spirit
Case example of a competitor's slow adaptation to market changes
Brand Information and Closing Remarks
Dermalogica's availability and access to professional treatments
Gratitude for guest participation and promotion of Dermalogica's socials and website
Encouragement for listener support and engagement with the DTC community
Growth Challenges and Strategies
Transitioning a business for growth
Importance of the right CEO to unlock growth
Initial challenges and goals as a new CEO
Omnichannel Approach and Growth Levers
Utilizing multiple sales avenues
Identifying and leveraging growth opportunities
Innovative Problem-Solving and Delegation
Approaching problems with innovation across all company functions
Implementing delegation of authority with appropriate guardrails
Encouraging data-driven decisions and embracing failure
Successful Innovations and Multi-Pronged Approach
Examples of successful product and platform innovations
Ensuring success across different teams and channels through a multi-pronged approach
✏️ Custom Newsletter
Subject: New DTC POD Episode Drop! 🎧 Aurelian Lis Shares Insights on Driving Growth
Hey there, DTC enthusiasts! 👋
We've got an exciting new episode of the DTC POD ready for your listening pleasure! In this episode, Blaine Bolus sits down with Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, to discuss how he's taken the brand to new heights since joining the company.
Here are 5 key takeaways you'll learn from this episode:
The importance of fostering a culture of innovation across all company functions, not just product development. 💡
How to effectively manage a brand with diverse distribution channels, from salons to retail to DTC. 🛍️
The power of delegating authority with appropriate guardrails to empower teams. 🤝
Why it's crucial to embrace data-driven decisions and not fear failure. 📊
How a multi-pronged approach can ensure success across different teams and channels. 🚀
Fun Fact: Did you know that Aurelian Lis has a background in atomic physics and laser optics? Talk about a unique path to becoming a CEO in the skincare industry! 🔬
So, grab your favorite beverage, get comfy, and tune in to this fantastic episode. You won't want to miss the valuable insights Aurelian shares about driving growth and success in the ever-evolving world of DTC.
Before we sign off, don't forget to join our DTC POD Slack community! It's the perfect place to connect with fellow DTC founders and operators, share ideas, and engage with top minds in the industry. Click the link in the episode description to apply. 🤳
Happy listening!
The DTC POD Team
🐦 Business Lesson Tweet Thread
🧵 True innovation isn't just developing new products. It's a mindset that permeates every aspect of your business.
That's what Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, discovered when he took the reins of the company after its acquisition by Unilever.
Growth had stagnated. To reignite it, Lis had to change how they operated across diverse global markets and distribution channels.
His approach? Empower teams to innovate fearlessly in all areas - marketing, tech, processes. Embrace data-driven decisions. Don't punish failure; learn from it.
This led to breakthroughs like AI-powered skin analysis, a revamped vitamin C product line, and agile transitions to new commerce platforms.
The lesson is clear: In a world of rapid change, adaptability is your greatest asset. Foster it in your people and weave it into the fabric of your company culture.
That's how you unlock sustainable growth and stay ahead of the curve, no matter what challenges come your way.
🎓 Lessons Learned
Here are the top 10 lessons covered in the podcast episode, with concise titles and brief descriptions for each:
Slack Community for Founders D2C pod launches Slack group for founders to connect, share ideas, and engage with industry leaders.
HubSpot's Comprehensive Sales Hub Bolus promotes HubSpot's Sales Hub with process management, AI tools, integrations, and scalable pricing for growth.
Lis's Diverse Professional Background Guest Aurelian Lis shares his experience in physics, finance, sales, marketing, and skincare industries.
Delia's Innovative E-commerce Strategies Lis helped take Delia's public with revenue growth and pioneering e-commerce tactics during early internet era.
Dermalogica's Education-Focused Approach The company operates like a university, training 100,000 skin therapists annually in the U.S.
AI for Personalization and Efficiency Dermalogica uses AI and machine learning for website testing, personalization, translations, and employee upskilling.
Face Mapping for Tailored Treatments Advanced facial analysis with GenAI provides personalized skin treatment suggestions, increasing sales and customer satisfaction.
Therapist Network Extends Brand Experience Trained therapists serve as first touchpoints for consumers, helping to scale personalized experiences with AI support.
Authentic Omnichannel Brand Consistency Dermalogica maintains its brand essence across professional settings, retail environments, and digital platforms.
Adaptive Leadership Fosters Innovation Lis emphasizes a culture of continuous improvement, embracing change, and correcting course when needed for growth.
💎 Maxims
Here is a list of maxims for success distilled from the key concepts discussed in the DTC POD episode with Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica:
Embrace change and continuously innovate to drive growth. Don't fear failure.
Maintain an entrepreneurial spirit and adaptive leadership, even as your company scales. Course correct as needed.
Build a flat organizational structure that empowers teams to make data-driven decisions within appropriate guardrails.
Pursue innovation across all areas of the business, not just products. Encourage experimentation.
Develop an omnichannel strategy to succeed across diverse sales channels, catering to their unique business models.
Cultivate a passionate community around your brand. Turn customers into loyal advocates.
Seamlessly integrate technology to enhance, not replace, meaningful human interactions and personalized experiences.
Maintain authenticity and consistency in expressing your brand's identity and values across all touchpoints.
Creatively adapt your brand experiences to thrive in different environments, from professional to retail settings.
Stay on the cutting edge - be an early adopter of emerging platforms and technologies to effectively engage consumers.
As a leader, foster a culture that embraces change and encourages innovative thinking at all levels.
Focus on providing true personalization through exceptional service and building real relationships with customers.
View business as an ever-changing landscape that demands constant evolution. Complacency is not an option.
When resources are limited, judiciously decide what to handle in-house vs outsource to optimize your operations.
Learn from mistakes and roadblocks. Often the path to success is through experimentation and iteration.
🌟 3 Fun Facts
Aurelian Lis has an academic background in atomic physics and laser optics before transitioning into the beauty industry.
Dermalogica has performed over 2.5 million facial skin analyses using AI-powered 'face mapping' technology to provide personalized product recommendations.
The Dermalogica team quickly adapted ChatGPT within months of its release to create a chatbot that helps their skin therapists find product information.
📓 Blog Post
Title: Adaptive Leadership and Innovation: Aurelian Lis on Driving Growth at Dermalogica
Subheader: CEO Aurelian Lis shares insights on fostering a culture of innovation, navigating omnichannel strategies, and harnessing technology to enhance customer experiences.
Introduction In a recent episode of the DTC POD, host Blaine Bolus sat down with Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, to discuss his journey in leading the skincare brand to new heights. With a background in atomic physics and experience across various industries, Lis brought a unique perspective on driving growth through adaptive leadership and continuous innovation.
Embracing Change and Innovation One of the key themes throughout the conversation was the importance of embracing change and fostering a culture of innovation. Lis emphasized that successful brands must maintain an entrepreneurial spirit, with leaders willing to explore new opportunities and course-correct when necessary. He cited an example of a competitor's slow adaptation to Amazon Prime Beauty, highlighting the risks of complacency in a rapidly evolving market.
Lis shared that since taking the helm at Dermalogica, he has focused on encouraging innovation across all aspects of the business, not just product development. By empowering teams to take calculated risks and make data-driven decisions, the company has seen significant growth, more than doubling in size under his leadership.
Navigating Omnichannel Strategies Another critical aspect of Dermalogica's success has been its ability to navigate the complexities of an omnichannel approach. With a presence in salons, Medispas, retail outlets, DTC, Amazon Marketplace, and flagship stores, the brand has had to develop strategies that cater to the unique needs of each channel.
Lis stressed the importance of understanding the different business models and tailoring approaches accordingly. By providing a seamless and consistent brand experience across all touchpoints, Dermalogica has been able to build a loyal customer base and drive growth in various markets.
Harnessing Technology for Personalization Throughout the discussion, Lis highlighted the role of technology in enhancing the customer experience and supporting the brand's network of skincare therapists. Dermalogica has embraced AI and machine learning to offer personalized product recommendations and treatments, such as their advanced facial skin analysis tool, "face mapping."
By leveraging technology to provide more targeted suggestions and support, the company has seen higher purchase completions and average order values. However, Lis emphasized that technology should be used to enhance, rather than replace, human interaction. He believes that true personalization stems from meaningful connections between therapists and clients, and technology should be used to scale and support these relationships.
Building a Strong Community Central to Dermalogica's success is its strong community of professional skincare therapists, referred to as the "tribe." By investing in education and training for these therapists, the brand has created a network of loyal advocates who serve as the first touchpoint for many new customers.
Lis emphasized the importance of maintaining authenticity and consistently embodying the brand's essence across all channels, from professional settings to retail environments. By finding creative ways to bring the Dermalogica experience to life, such as incorporating treatment beds in retail stores, the company has been able to build a strong and recognizable brand identity.
Conclusion Aurelian Lis's insights provide valuable lessons for founders and operators looking to drive growth in their own businesses. By embracing change, fostering innovation, navigating omnichannel strategies, harnessing technology for personalization, and building a strong community, brands can position themselves for success in an ever-evolving market. As Lis and the Dermalogica team have demonstrated, adaptive leadership and a willingness to experiment are key to unlocking long-term growth and staying ahead of the competition.
🎤 Voiceover Script
In this episode, Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, shares insights on driving growth and innovation in a well-established brand.
Discover how he doubled the business by:
-Implementing a multi-pronged strategy across diverse distribution channels. -Fostering a culture of innovation and data-driven decision-making. -Empowering teams to take risks and learn from failures. -Adapting to the unique needs of each market and sales avenue.
Tune in to learn how you can unlock growth in your own brand, regardless of its size or history.
🔘 Best Practices Guide
Best Practices for Driving Growth and Innovation in DTC Brands
Embrace an adaptive, entrepreneurial leadership style that encourages experimentation and course correction.
Foster a culture of innovation across all company functions, not just product development. Encourage teams to take calculated risks and make data-driven decisions.
Implement a clear delegation of authority with appropriate guardrails to empower teams and drive growth.
Develop a multi-pronged strategy that caters to diverse distribution channels, such as salons, retail, DTC, and marketplaces, considering their unique business models.
Continuously seek opportunities for improvement and innovation, staying ahead of industry trends and changes in consumer behavior.
Leverage technology, such as AI and machine learning, to enhance personalization, improve customer experiences, and support your internal teams.
Maintain a consistent brand identity and essence across all platforms and touchpoints, ensuring authentic and meaningful consumer interactions.
🎆 Social Carousel: Do's/Don'ts
Cover Slide: 10 Retention Marketing Tips from Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica
Slide 1: Don't Stagnate Continuously innovate in technology, products, and processes to drive growth.
Slide 2: Don't Fear AI Embrace AI for personalization, upskilling employees, and enhancing customer experiences.
Slide 3: Don't Replace Humans Use technology to enhance, not replace, meaningful human interactions.
Slide 4: Don't Compromise Authenticity Maintain a consistent brand identity across all platforms and experiences.
Slide 5: Don't Avoid Change Harness change for growth; adapt to new technologies and platforms.
Slide 6: Don't Micromanage Delegate authority with appropriate guardrails to empower teams.
Slide 7: Don't Limit Innovation Encourage innovation across all company functions, not just products.
Slide 8: Don't Punish Failure Create a culture where teams use data-driven decisions without fearing failure.
Slide 9: Don't Rely on One Channel Develop strategies for diverse channels: salons, retail, DTC, and marketplaces.
Slide 10: Don't Think Small Approach problems holistically; success comes from multi-pronged, team-driven initiatives.
🎠 Social Carousel
Cover Slide: 8 Lessons Every D2C Founder Needs to Know
Slide 1: Embrace Change Continuously innovate and adapt to stay relevant in an ever-evolving market.
Slide 2: Consistent Branding Maintain a consistent brand identity across all platforms and experiences.
Slide 3: Leverage Technology Harness new technologies and platforms to engage consumers effectively.
Slide 4: Foster Innovation Encourage a culture of innovation and adaptability from the top down.
Slide 5: Personalize Interactions Engage customers on a personal level for true, meaningful personalization.
Slide 6: Creative Retail Bring brand experiences to life in retail spaces through innovative adaptations.
Slide 7: Delegate Authority Empower teams to make data-driven decisions with appropriate guardrails.
Slide 8: Omnichannel Strategy Utilize multiple sales avenues and tailor strategies for each channel.
CTA Slide: Join the DTC POD Slack Community Connect with fellow D2C founders and operators. Apply now at dtcpod.com!
One Off Tweets
Tweet 1 Aurelian Lis shares his journey from atomic physics to CEO of Dermalogica. Diverse experiences across finance, sales, and marketing shaped his leadership approach. Embrace change and let your unique path guide your success.
Tweet 2 AI is not just a buzzword at Dermalogica. From personalized skin analysis to upskilling employees, they harness the power of AI across the organization. Embrace technology to enhance, not replace, human interaction.
Tweet 3 True personalization goes beyond superficial digital experiences. It's about engaging with customers on a personal level, especially in a brand focused on physical connections. Dermalogica's "tribe" of skincare therapists embodies this authentic approach.
Tweet 4 Consistency is key across all brand touchpoints. Whether in professional settings or retail environments, Dermalogica strives to maintain its essence. Innovative adaptations bring their unique experiences to life, even in unconventional spaces.
Tweet 5 Complacency is the enemy of growth. Dermalogica's leadership fosters a culture of continuous improvement and adaptability. Embrace change and harness it for growth, or risk being left behind.
Tweet 6 Founders often face the dilemma of in-house vs. outsourcing. Experimentation and learning from dead ends are crucial for finding successful strategies. Embrace the entrepreneurial spirit and be willing to explore and correct course as needed.
Tweet 7 Slow adaptation can be costly. A competitor's late entry to Amazon Prime Beauty by 5 years serves as a cautionary tale. Stay agile and responsive to changing market dynamics to maintain a competitive edge.
Tweet 8 Growth is a sign of winning new battles and doing the right thing. Dermalogica has more than doubled since Aurelian Lis took over as CEO. Adapt your strategy to cater to diverse distribution channels and unlock growth potential.
Tweet 9 Real opportunity lies in how you approach problems, not just single initiatives. Empower teams with delegation and appropriate guardrails. Foster a culture of innovation across all company functions, not just product development.
Tweet 10 Data-driven decisions and a willingness to fail are essential for success. Dermalogica's multi-pronged approach ensures growth across different teams and channels. Embrace a mindset of experimentation and let data guide your path forward.
Twitter Post 1
This AI-powered skin analysis tool, called 'face mapping', has helped over 2.5 million consumers get personalized treatment plans.
The result? Higher purchase rates and bigger order sizes.
Mindsets
Here are 3 mindset shifts based on the DTC POD episode with Aurelian Lis that listeners can implement:
💭 Embrace change as an opportunity for growth. Instead of fearing new technologies, platforms, or consumer behaviors, view them as chances to innovate and adapt your brand to stay relevant. Continuously seek out ways to improve your offerings and engage your audience more effectively.
💭 Prioritize authentic human connections. While digital tools can enhance personalization, true connection stems from meaningful interactions between people. Strive to create experiences that foster genuine relationships with your customers, whether through expert advice, personalized treatments, or community building.
💭 Cultivate a culture of innovation at all levels. Encourage your entire team, from leadership down, to experiment, learn from failures, and make data-driven decisions. By fostering an entrepreneurial spirit and empowering your staff to take calculated risks, you can build an organization that is agile, adaptive, and poised for long-term success.
For more insights on leadership, innovation, and building a thriving brand, be sure to check out the full episode of DTC POD featuring Aurelian Lis, CEO of Dermalogica, wherever you get your podcasts.
Tactics
🎙️ 5 Tactics to Elevate Your Business, Inspired by Aurelian Lis on the DTC POD 🎙️
If you're a founder or operator looking to take your business to new heights, here are some powerful strategies gleaned from Aurelian Lis's insights on the DTC POD:
🔍 Embrace a culture of innovation across all functions, not just product development. Encourage your teams to experiment, learn from failures, and make data-driven decisions. This mindset shift can lead to breakthroughs in marketing, operations, and customer experience.
🌐 Develop a multi-channel strategy that caters to the unique needs of each distribution avenue. Whether it's DTC, retail partnerships, or marketplaces like Amazon, tailor your approach to optimize success in each channel while maintaining a consistent brand identity.
🤝 Invest in building a strong community around your brand. For Dermalogica, this means nurturing a "tribe" of skincare professionals who embody the brand's values. Consider how you can create lasting relationships with your customers and advocates that extend beyond transactions.
🤖 Harness the power of AI and machine learning to enhance, not replace, human interactions. From personalized product recommendations to chatbots that support your team, find ways to leverage technology to scale personalized experiences and drive customer satisfaction.
🌊 Adopt an adaptive leadership style that embraces change. Stay attuned to shifts in your industry, consumer behavior, and emerging platforms. Foster a culture that encourages continuous learning and improvement, so you can navigate the waves of change and stay ahead of the curve.
By implementing these strategies, you'll be well on your way to unlocking new growth opportunities and building a thriving, resilient brand. 🚀
In Depth Thread
Aurelian's Advice: Adaptive Leadership.
In a rapidly changing business landscape, brands that retain an entrepreneurial spirit thrive.
Overrated: Rigid operations.
Some companies, in pursuit of scale, solidify processes to a fault.
Underrated: Continuous innovation.
Successful leaders explore new strategies and correct course as needed to stay ahead. 3 Key Takeaways
Aurelian emphasized these points for founders and operators:
Innovate continuously and stay adaptable
Don't fear change; harness it for growth
Maintain brand consistency across various platforms Embrace Technology
Dermalogica swiftly integrates emerging tech to enhance consumer experiences:
Within months of ChatGPT's debut, they launched an AI chatbot to assist skin therapists. AI-powered tools like 'face mapping' enable personalized treatments, driving higher sales and engagement.
Machine learning optimizes website testing and personalization. Brand Authenticity
Dermalogica aims to embody its essence consistently, from professional settings to retail:
Their signature personalized skin treatments stem from meaningful human interactions.
Even in retail spaces like Sephora, they innovatively bring those experiences to life. Organizational Agility
Small brands often face tough calls on outsourcing vs. in-house due to limited resources.
Entrepreneurs navigate this by experimenting, learning from failures, and adapting.
Aurelian cited a competitor's 5-year delay in joining Amazon Prime Beauty as a cautionary tale. The Dermalogica Difference
Found at Dermalogica.com and retailers like Ulta, Sephora & Amazon.
Offers access to professional facial skin treatments.
Trains a global network of 100,000+ skin therapists annually.
Focuses on teaching skin science, operating like a skincare university. Under Aurelian's leadership, the business has more than doubled by:
Implementing a multi-pronged, data-driven approach across teams and channels.
Delegating authority with appropriate guardrails to foster innovation.
Encouraging teams to embrace change and not fear failure.
New Idea
Idea #1: Embrace Change and Innovation
To thrive in a dynamic business environment, brands must embrace change and foster a culture of innovation, as evidenced by:
Adapting to New Platforms: Dermalogica quickly recognized the potential of emerging platforms like TikTok and adapted their strategies to effectively engage consumers on these new channels.
Leveraging AI Technology: The company integrated AI and machine learning into various aspects of their operations, from website testing and personalization to advanced facial skin analysis, enhancing the customer experience and supporting their network of trained therapists.
Leadership Driving Innovation: Aurelian Lis emphasized the importance of leadership in driving a culture of innovation and adaptability, encouraging the team to embrace change and continuously seek improvement across all areas of the business.
Tweet thread on learnings
Tweet 1: 🎙️ Listened to an insightful episode of the DTC POD with guest @AurelianLis, CEO of @Dermalogica
Key takeaways on driving growth and innovation in a skincare brand:
🧵 Thread 👇
Tweet 2:
🌊 Embrace change and adapt quickly
As a leader, foster a culture that encourages innovation and isn't afraid to experiment.
Dermalogica rapidly integrated AI like ChatGPT to enhance their customer experience and support their therapist network.
Tweet 3:
🤝 Maintain authenticity across all touchpoints
Ensure your brand's essence shines through consistently, whether in professional settings, retail environments, or digital platforms.
Dermalogica strives to bring their signature treatments to life, even in unconventional retail spaces.
Tweet 4:
🧠 Leverage AI to personalize and scale
Dermalogica uses AI and machine learning for website optimization, product suggestions, and their advanced 'face mapping' skin analysis.
Over 2.5M consumers have experienced personalized recommendations, leading to higher purchase rates and order values.
Tweet 5:
👥 Invest in your community
Dermalogica's strength lies in their network of trained skin therapists, their "tribe."
By continuously educating and empowering them, they create authentic brand ambassadors who extend the brand experience to consumers.
Tweet 6:
🚀 Stay agile as you grow
Even as a global brand with 1500+ employees, Dermalogica maintains a flat organizational structure.
This allows them to remain nimble, innovate quickly, and adapt to changing market dynamics.
Tweet 7: The key to sustained growth? Never stop innovating.
Embrace change, harness technology, and always seek to enhance the customer experience.
By staying true to their brand while continuously evolving, @Dermalogica has positioned itself for long-term success in the competitive skincare industry.
Future State, 6 reasons post
In 12 months, Dermalogica doubled its business growth by adapting to the evolving landscape of consumer engagement and embracing innovation across all aspects of the company. As a leading skincare brand, Dermalogica has unlocked the power of personalization and technology to enhance the customer experience. But the journey is far from over. Here are 6 recommendations that, if applied, will lead Dermalogica to even greater heights:
BACKGROUND:
Forget traditional skincare; the future belongs to personalized, AI-driven experiences that seamlessly blend human expertise with cutting-edge technology.
Dermalogica is where the boundaries between professional treatments and at-home skincare blur, creating a holistic approach to skin health.
If Dermalogica continues to innovate, it can transform itself into an end-to-end skincare ecosystem that not only educates and empowers skin therapists but also engages and delights consumers at every touchpoint.
Previous State:
Flat business growth
Limited technology integration
Siloed distribution channels
Slow adaptation to market changes
Future State:
Exponential business growth
Seamless integration of AI and machine learning
Omnichannel strategy that caters to diverse channels
Agile and responsive to market shifts
Culture of innovation across all functions
At Dermalogica, we are already seeing the impact of our innovative approach, with over 2.5 million consumers benefiting from our advanced face mapping technology and personalized skin treatments. It's hard to replicate this success with traditional skincare models.
HOWEVER...
We must continue to push boundaries and explore new frontiers in skincare. The leadership team at Dermalogica should consider implementing the following recommendations to solidify our position as the leading innovator in the industry.
Here are my 6 recommendations:
Expand the use of AI and machine learning beyond marketing and product naming. Explore applications in product development, supply chain optimization, and customer service to create a truly AI-driven skincare ecosystem.
Develop a mobile app that integrates face mapping technology with virtual consultations, allowing consumers to receive personalized skincare recommendations and connect with skin therapists anytime, anywhere.
Create a loyalty program that rewards consumers for engaging with the brand across multiple channels, encouraging them to explore different product lines and services while fostering long-term relationships.
Invest in augmented reality (AR) technology to enhance the retail experience, enabling consumers to virtually try on products, access interactive tutorials, and visualize the effects of different skincare regimens.
Establish a global network of Dermalogica ambassadors, comprising influential skin therapists and skincare enthusiasts, to amplify the brand's message and reach new audiences through authentic, user-generated content.
Launch a skincare education platform that offers both online and offline courses, empowering aspiring skin therapists and skincare professionals to expand their knowledge and skills while strengthening their connection to the Dermalogica tribe.
I believe that by implementing these recommendations, Dermalogica can not only maintain its position as a leader in the skincare industry but also redefine the very essence of what it means to be a skincare brand in the digital age.
As consumer preferences continue to evolve and technology advances at an unprecedented pace, Dermalogica has the opportunity to set the standard for innovation, personalization, and customer-centricity in the skincare industry.
P.S.
What other ways do you think Dermalogica can leverage technology to enhance the customer experience?
Do you believe that the future of skincare lies in the seamless integration of human expertise and artificial intelligence?
About the Episode
Aurelian Lis is the CEO of Dermalogica, a prominent skincare brand known for its innovative products and education-focused approach. With a background spanning atomic physics, finance, sales, and marketing, Aurelian brings a wealth of experience to his role.
In this episode of DTC POD, Aurelian discusses the strategies that have fueled Dermalogica's growth since he took the helm. He emphasizes the importance of fostering a culture of innovation across all aspects of the business, from product development to marketing and operations. By empowering teams to experiment, learn from failures, and make data-driven decisions, Dermalogica has been able to adapt and thrive in an ever-changing landscape.
Aurelian also highlights the brand's multi-pronged approach to success, which involves tailoring strategies to different distribution channels, including salons, retail partners, DTC, and marketplaces. By understanding the unique needs of each channel and leveraging technology to enhance personalization and customer experience, Dermalogica has been able to more than double its business under Aurelian's leadership.
Throughout the conversation, Aurelian underscores the significance of maintaining a strong brand identity and consistently delivering authentic experiences across all touchpoints. He shares insights on how Dermalogica integrates its education-focused ethos into various settings, from professional treatments to retail environments, and how the brand fosters a sense of community among its network of skincare therapists.
Episode Summary
Aurelian Lis is the CEO of Dermalogica, a prominent skincare brand known for its innovative products and focus on educating professional skin therapists. He brings a diverse background spanning physics, finance, sales, and marketing from his previous roles at prestigious companies.
In this episode of DTC Pod, Aurelian discusses how Dermalogica balances cutting-edge technology with personalized human experiences to drive growth and customer engagement. He shares insights on fostering a culture of innovation, maintaining brand consistency across channels, and adapting to the evolving e-commerce landscape.
Success Strategies
Innovate across all business functions, not just product
Innovation is the driving force behind the success of any DTC brand, but it's essential to recognize that it extends far beyond product development alone. To truly differentiate yourself in a crowded market, you need to embed a culture of creativity, experimentation, and continuous improvement across every facet of your organization, from marketing and customer experience to operations, technology, and beyond.
Encourage your teams to think boldly, question assumptions, and push boundaries. Give them the freedom, resources, and support they need to ideate, test, and iterate, using data and customer feedback to guide their decisions. By fostering a company-wide mindset of innovation, you can uncover new efficiencies, identify untapped growth opportunities, and adapt quickly to evolving customer needs and market dynamics.
It's important to remember that innovation doesn't always have to be revolutionary or disruptive. Even small, incremental optimizations can compound over time to create significant impact. Celebrate the wins, learn from the failures, and keep pushing forward with a relentless focus on improvement. By making innovation a core pillar of your DTC brand's DNA, you can stay ahead of the curve, anticipate future trends, and build a sustainable competitive advantage that stands the test of time.
Leverage AI to scale personalization
In today's hyper-competitive DTC landscape, personalization has evolved from a nice-to-have to a fundamental customer expectation. Consumers increasingly demand tailored experiences that cater to their unique preferences, needs, and behaviors, and the brands that can deliver on this promise are the ones that will win their loyalty and advocacy. However, as your customer base grows and diversifies, providing one-to-one personalization at scale can quickly become a daunting challenge. This is where the power of artificial intelligence and machine learning comes into play.
By leveraging AI-driven technologies, you can harness the vast amounts of customer data at your fingertips to gain deep, actionable insights into their individual journeys, interests, pain points, and aspirations. Use this knowledge to create hyper-targeted product recommendations, content, offers, and experiences that resonate with each customer on a personal level, making them feel seen, understood, and valued at every touchpoint.
Take inspiration from Dermalogica's innovative approach to personalization. By using advanced facial mapping technology to analyze each customer's unique skin type, concerns, and goals, they can offer customized skincare regimens and treatments that feel tailored to the individual, even as their customer base scales. By investing in AI-powered personalization, they can deliver a high-touch, human-centric experience that builds trust, loyalty, and long-term value.
Consider how you can apply similar principles to your own DTC brand, leveraging AI to create personalized experiences that surprise and delight your customers. Whether it's using predictive analytics to anticipate their needs and preferences, dynamically adjusting website content and product recommendations based on their behavior, or offering intelligent chatbot support that learns and adapts over time, the possibilities are endless. By making personalization a core pillar of your strategy and leveraging AI to scale it effectively, you can forge deeper, more meaningful connections with your customers that drive engagement, retention, and growth.
Keep the human touch alive
In an increasingly digital and automated world, it's easy to get swept up in the allure of new technologies and lose sight of the fundamental human element that underlies all great brands. However, as Aurelian Lis wisely reminds us, the most successful DTC companies are those that never forget the importance of genuine, person-to-person connection. While AI, machine learning, and other cutting-edge tools can help you scale and optimize your operations, they should always be balanced with authentic, empathetic interactions that build trust, rapport, and emotional resonance with your customers.
Consider how Dermalogica has built its brand around a network of highly trained skincare therapists who provide in-person treatments, education, and guidance to customers. These human touchpoints not only ensure a high-quality, personalized experience but also create opportunities for building deep, lasting relationships that extend far beyond the transaction itself. By investing in the human side of their business, Dermalogica has cultivated a loyal community of advocates who feel genuinely seen, heard, and valued by the brand.
Think about how you can infuse your own DTC brand with a similar human touch, even as you embrace digital transformation. This might mean building a knowledgeable, empathetic customer service team that goes above and beyond to solve problems, provide support, and exceed expectations at every turn. It could involve hosting in-person events, workshops, or pop-ups that allow customers to engage with your brand and products in a tangible, multisensory way, creating memorable experiences that forge emotional connections. Or it might mean featuring real employees, customers, and their stories in your marketing content, showcasing the authentic, relatable human faces behind your brand.
By finding creative ways to balance the convenience and efficiency of technology with the warmth and authenticity of human interaction, you can differentiate your DTC brand in a crowded online marketplace and foster the kind of deep, emotional loyalty that keeps customers coming back time and time again. Remember, at the end of the day, people buy from people, not just faceless algorithms or automated systems. By keeping the human element at the very heart of your DTC strategy, you can build a brand that not only delivers exceptional products and experiences but also makes a profound, lasting impact on the lives of your customers, earning their trust, advocacy, and unwavering support for years to come.
Castmagic LinkedIn Post
Want to know how AI is shaking up the skincare game? 🧴💻
Aurelian Lis, the brain behind global skincare brand Dermalogica, sits down with Blaine Bolus to spill the tea on their cutting-edge approach. 🫖
From using AI in marketing to personalizing customer experiences, Aurelian breaks down how Dermalogica is nailing the balance between tech and human touch. 🤝
We also dive into what it takes to keep innovation flowing, how to roll with the punches in retail, and the challenges of growing post-acquisition. 📈
Tune in for a skincare masterclass you won't want to miss! 🎧👉 [link]
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